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> I had friends who became Trump supporters, and I unfriended them. I believe in morals. Ironically, the behavior you describe is immoral in my view. I also am

> I had friends who became Trump supporters, and I unfriended them. I believe in morals. Ironically, the behavior you describe is immoral in my view. I also am a religious person, and I also don't believe in bending morals or that talk will heal all disagreements. However, with political opinions, the primary reason otherwise well intentioned people support bad things is that they don't understand that they are bad. Shunning someone actively makes that situation worse. Sure you can't win people over by arguments, but you can influence them gradually, and if they are your friends, you should want to do that for their own good.

ss108 4y ago
I understand your perspective, but I do not think that they do not understand that the things are bad. From what I can tell from conversations those people, they, for the most part, just don't give a shit about what's good and bad.
- ifyoubuildit 4y ago
  Have you heard of the fundamental attribution error? https://online.hbs.edu/blog/post/the-fundamental-attribution-error?sf55808584=1 https://online.hbs.edu/blog/post/the-fundamental-attribution... I think it's relevant here. Added to "don't understand" and "dont care" is a third option: "don't agree", based on different upbringings and cultural values, some of which you or I would find abhorrent, because of our own upbringing and cultural values. But I think you should recognize that there is a good chance you'd have the same beliefs if you had the same life experience.
  - ss108 4y ago
    > But I think you should recognize that there is a good chance you'd have the same beliefs if you had the same life experience. What's the point of this line of thinking? Ok, maybe we'd also join the Taliban if we grew up in orphanages in Pakistan after Russia invaded Afghanistan. So? The thrust of your arguments here (the article and the life experience thing) seems to be to not hold anyone morally accountable for anything.
    - ifyoubuildit 4y ago
      The point is to recognize the humans on the receiving end of your judgement. They aren't inherently bad people. There was a series of events that led them to where they are, just like you. They are capable of all the same things you are. Once you recognize that these people are human, you have a chance at maybe effecting some kind of change. Looking at them as animals means you will never effect any positive change, and you'll probably contribute to an even worse us-against-them kind of environment.

ss108 4y ago

I understand your perspective, but I do not think that they do not understand that the things are bad. From what I can tell from conversations those people, they, for the most part, just don't give a shit about what's good and bad.

ifyoubuildit 4y ago
Have you heard of the fundamental attribution error? https://online.hbs.edu/blog/post/the-fundamental-attribution-error?sf55808584=1 https://online.hbs.edu/blog/post/the-fundamental-attribution... I think it's relevant here. Added to "don't understand" and "dont care" is a third option: "don't agree", based on different upbringings and cultural values, some of which you or I would find abhorrent, because of our own upbringing and cultural values. But I think you should recognize that there is a good chance you'd have the same beliefs if you had the same life experience.
- ss108 4y ago
  > But I think you should recognize that there is a good chance you'd have the same beliefs if you had the same life experience. What's the point of this line of thinking? Ok, maybe we'd also join the Taliban if we grew up in orphanages in Pakistan after Russia invaded Afghanistan. So? The thrust of your arguments here (the article and the life experience thing) seems to be to not hold anyone morally accountable for anything.
  - ifyoubuildit 4y ago
    The point is to recognize the humans on the receiving end of your judgement. They aren't inherently bad people. There was a series of events that led them to where they are, just like you. They are capable of all the same things you are. Once you recognize that these people are human, you have a chance at maybe effecting some kind of change. Looking at them as animals means you will never effect any positive change, and you'll probably contribute to an even worse us-against-them kind of environment.