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But the man does own the courts and pretty much all politicians, so there's very little anyone can do. He threw his biggest political opponent in jail so he ca

But the man does own the courts and pretty much all politicians, so there's very little anyone can do. He threw his biggest political opponent in jail so he can win the next presidential "election" in peace.

grugagag 4y ago
It starts with one nail in the coffin, then another one, then another one.. Eventually most autocrats ends up badly after some time.
at-fates-hands 4y ago
He also blamed all the developers and immediately arrested them: Vice President Fuat Oktay said overnight that 131 suspects had so far been identified as responsible for the collapse of some of the thousands of buildings flattened in the 10 provinces affected by the tremors early last Monday. https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/turkey-steps-up-collapsed-buildings-investigation-orders-113-arrested-2023-02-12/ https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/turkey-steps-up-co...
- TylerE 4y ago
  Well, I mean, they should be, too. Nothing forcing them to request such an "amnesty" except greed.
  - munk-a 4y ago
    These folks definitely deserve a pretty big penalty levied on them - but if the policy of giving out these sorts of amnesties isn't reformed we can expect a repeat. I'm concerned that the government is going to force all of the blame onto these contractors for political reasons and won't end up enacting any reforms of inspectors since it'd make Erdogan look bad.
  - gameman144 4y ago
    It seems pretty ridiculous for a government official to say "I am giving you permission to bypass these rules" and then arrest them for breaking those rules. Sure, requesting an exemption may be an act of greed, but the role of responsible government is to say "No, those rules are there for a reason". If developers legally bypassed regulations due to the government saying it's okay, the buck should absolutely stop with the government, and the question should be why they allowed those exemptions.
    - munk-a 4y ago
      I don't disagree with you but I think there is a sort of difference that makes the comparison to software developers[1] a bit false. The cost for software developers[1] to fix things after the fact is generally lower than the cost of developing it again from scratch - the cost for contractors to fix an existing fully constructed building that didn't have rebar put in is... tear it all down (expensive), dispose of all that waste (expensive), probably double check the site to make sure things in the ground didn't shift during the construction and destruction (expensive) and rebuild the building from scratch. Personally I'm against amnesty for contractors - if a building was poorly constructed the people responsible for that decision should be treated harshly... but I think there is a reasonable discussion to have around amnesty for the buildings themselves. 1. (Was originally just "developers" edited to "software developers" for clarity)
      - valarauko 4y ago
        > The cost for developers to fix things after the fact is generally lower than the cost of developing it again from scratch I don't follow - could you expand on why this would be the case? What's the distinction here between the developer and the contractor when it comes to costs?
        munk-a 4y ago
        Sorry, the terminology is kind of terrible here - by developer I meant software developer. That's pretty egregiously confusing so I've edited the comment. I'm actually uncertain now if the parent I was replying to was talking about software or real estate developers so my response might be a bit of a miss.

grugagag 4y ago

It starts with one nail in the coffin, then another one, then another one.. Eventually most autocrats ends up badly after some time.

at-fates-hands 4y ago

He also blamed all the developers and immediately arrested them: Vice President Fuat Oktay said overnight that 131 suspects had so far been identified as responsible for the collapse of some of the thousands of buildings flattened in the 10 provinces affected by the tremors early last Monday. https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/turkey-steps-up-collapsed-buildings-investigation-orders-113-arrested-2023-02-12/ https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/turkey-steps-up-co...

TylerE 4y ago
Well, I mean, they should be, too. Nothing forcing them to request such an "amnesty" except greed.
- munk-a 4y ago
  These folks definitely deserve a pretty big penalty levied on them - but if the policy of giving out these sorts of amnesties isn't reformed we can expect a repeat. I'm concerned that the government is going to force all of the blame onto these contractors for political reasons and won't end up enacting any reforms of inspectors since it'd make Erdogan look bad.
- gameman144 4y ago
  It seems pretty ridiculous for a government official to say "I am giving you permission to bypass these rules" and then arrest them for breaking those rules. Sure, requesting an exemption may be an act of greed, but the role of responsible government is to say "No, those rules are there for a reason". If developers legally bypassed regulations due to the government saying it's okay, the buck should absolutely stop with the government, and the question should be why they allowed those exemptions.
  - munk-a 4y ago
    I don't disagree with you but I think there is a sort of difference that makes the comparison to software developers[1] a bit false. The cost for software developers[1] to fix things after the fact is generally lower than the cost of developing it again from scratch - the cost for contractors to fix an existing fully constructed building that didn't have rebar put in is... tear it all down (expensive), dispose of all that waste (expensive), probably double check the site to make sure things in the ground didn't shift during the construction and destruction (expensive) and rebuild the building from scratch. Personally I'm against amnesty for contractors - if a building was poorly constructed the people responsible for that decision should be treated harshly... but I think there is a reasonable discussion to have around amnesty for the buildings themselves. 1. (Was originally just "developers" edited to "software developers" for clarity)
    - valarauko 4y ago
      > The cost for developers to fix things after the fact is generally lower than the cost of developing it again from scratch I don't follow - could you expand on why this would be the case? What's the distinction here between the developer and the contractor when it comes to costs?
      - munk-a 4y ago
        Sorry, the terminology is kind of terrible here - by developer I meant software developer. That's pretty egregiously confusing so I've edited the comment. I'm actually uncertain now if the parent I was replying to was talking about software or real estate developers so my response might be a bit of a miss.