7 ms·

Meh, you can call it value extraction if you want, but ultimately they're paying these people. Didn't Rogan get like 100MM? Didn't they fund a bunch of studios

Meh, you can call it value extraction if you want, but ultimately they're paying these people. Didn't Rogan get like 100MM? Didn't they fund a bunch of studios and new podcast creators? From the article: Its drastic cuts have triggered a podcast winter, as the small studios it helped support consolidate and lavish narrative productions wane Also, I've tried 4 different podcast players and found Spotify's player to best of the bunch. Controls work like you would expect, it's very snappy, search and sorting are also polished. I've pretty much stopped listening to Podcasts on Apple's native app because Spotify's superior experience. I do get what you're saying about RSS feeds though, but it's not quite as black and white as you make it. Edit - updated wording: + "found Spotify's player to best of the bunch" - "they're all terrible except for Spotify's"

simonh 4y ago
Try Overcast.
- suction 4y ago
  Used it for years but Pocket Casts beats it in all aspects.
- cccybernetic 4y ago
  Overall I like Overcast, definitely better than Apple’s app. I don’t like UI though — the teal blue color, oversized controls, the “+ + + +” on the playback speed slider, strange layout choices, etc. (I know that these are relatively minor things to most people).
  - schnable 4y ago
    you can change the colors if you get the premium version.
    - lostlogin 4y ago
      The concept of smart speed impressed me so much I got it. I don’t use the feature a to alter speed a lot, but it’s such a clever way to speeding things up.
cma 4y ago
> Didn't Rogan get like 100MM? They fund early people to get momentum and lock others in at high rates once they build out an audience.
- jrochkind1 4y ago
  Have you seen the recently published _Chokepoint Capitalism_ by Rebecca Giblin and Cory Doctorow yet? I think the book could have used a lot tighter editing, it gets kind of tiresome in many parts... but the basic fundamental observation seems right to me and helps give me the mental models to recognize and describe it. "it" being the way in the internet economy those who occupy that "middleman" position can become "chokepoints" who can hold both consumers and producers hostage. Or, as Doctorow wrote in a blog post covering some similar ground: > Here is how platforms die: first, they are good to their users; then they abuse their users to make things better for their business customers; finally, they abuse those business customers to claw back all the value for themselves. Then, they die. — https://pluralistic.net/2023/01/21/potemkin-ai/ https://pluralistic.net/2023/01/21/potemkin-ai/ I'm not sure if they all die, there are a LOT of platforms around which haven't died yet, but those first steps are very recognizable in chokepoint middlemen like Spotify is for music and is trying to become for podcasts. First you give both consumers and the "business customers" (whether podcast producers or product sellers on Amazon) a great deal; then, once you've locked the consumers in you make the deal for consumers a lot worse in order to keep your business customers on your side; then, once you've locked _them_ in too (perhaps because they need you to reach the consumers, who are all on your platform), you tighten things up for business customers too, trying to extract as much money as possible from consumers and share as little of it as possible with the producers, while both have a hard time leaving you due to network effects. So, yeah, it always starts great for your users. This is how you trap them, so you can then start tightening the screws.
- cccybernetic 4y ago
  I find your phrasing and mindset interesting. What you suggest somewhat maliciously as "lock others in at high rates", I read as "shower them with more cash than they could ever conceivably dream of" I'd love if my employer "locked me in" at a higher rate lol.
crossroadsguy 4y ago
You are on iPhone or Android? Or some other platform? Because on these platforms if I list best 4 podcast apps, Spotify won’t come within miles of that short list. I am slowly decreasing my use of Spotify because of the way it’s pushing podcasts while all I want is music from it. Nothing else.
- cccybernetic 4y ago
  iPhone - I'm happy to take recommendations.
  - ryeights 4y ago
    Pocket Casts is what I use, lots of useful features like silence trimming, voice amplification, organizational tools, chapters, and programmable skipping of intro ads. Recently open-sourced as well.
  - ndiddy 4y ago
    Castro is my favorite.
  - sleepybrett 4y ago
    i like overcast
  - dagw 4y ago
    Having tried most podcast apps, I always come back to Pocketcast.
- dotBen 4y ago
  I am slowly decreasing my use of Spotify because of the way it’s pushing podcasts while all I want is music from it. Best thing to do is actually to pay for Spotify and use it regularly, but never touch the podcasts. They have metrics and usage logging all over the app and they will know over time how few paying subscribers are listening to Joe Rogan et al. They'll soon give him the can if they know there's lower engagement than expected for the price being paid.
Adraghast 4y ago
> Also, I've tried 4 different podcast players and they're all terrible except for Spotify's. You’re the first person I’ve heard with anything positive to say about their podcast UI, so I’m really curious what those four are.
- cccybernetic 4y ago
  "Terrible" was too strong of a word -- I actually like Overcast, but find Spotify superior.
- eastbound 4y ago
  > so I’m really curious what those four are. Apple’s podcasts app goes out of its way to avoid showing the tracklist of the current channel or the list of recently played podcasts, or to make you misclick on the little channel name which changes the current track (given that you can’t list the recently played, any misclick is a major annoyance). I think they might have hired a AUX, an “anti-user experience” engineer.
  - mrcwinn 4y ago
    I use Apple Podcasts every day and experience none of these problems. Maybe give it another try if and when Spotify’s extra layer on ad logos and banners wears on you.
    - hnzix 4y ago
      Trying to setup chronological podcast playback on the Apple Podcast is horrible, and they are constantly fiddling with the terrible UI. I just want to binge 5 consecutive episodes of a history podcast, but everything in the UI tries to funnel you into listening to the latest episode of multiple podcasts.
      - mr_toad 4y ago
        It also seems to be impossible to get it to automatically download episodes in chronological order. It only wants to download new episodes. So if you run out of downloaded episodes it will skip forward to the new episodes, which could be years apart.
budu3 4y ago
The Google Podcasts app works for me. It has a minimalist feel to it.
josephd79 4y ago
Have you tried overcast?
pnutjam 4y ago
I used "Podcast Republic" for a long time, but it recently started downloading stuff automatically and I can't figure out how to tell it to stop. It filled up my storage with junk podcasts where I subscribed, but only listened to intermittently. So, I had to switch to spotify because it doesn't do that. I don't need to listen offline as much recently, since I wfh.

simonh 4y ago

Try Overcast.

suction 4y ago
Used it for years but Pocket Casts beats it in all aspects.
cccybernetic 4y ago
Overall I like Overcast, definitely better than Apple’s app. I don’t like UI though — the teal blue color, oversized controls, the “+ + + +” on the playback speed slider, strange layout choices, etc. (I know that these are relatively minor things to most people).
- schnable 4y ago
  you can change the colors if you get the premium version.
  - lostlogin 4y ago
    The concept of smart speed impressed me so much I got it. I don’t use the feature a to alter speed a lot, but it’s such a clever way to speeding things up.

cma 4y ago

> Didn't Rogan get like 100MM? They fund early people to get momentum and lock others in at high rates once they build out an audience.

jrochkind1 4y ago
Have you seen the recently published _Chokepoint Capitalism_ by Rebecca Giblin and Cory Doctorow yet? I think the book could have used a lot tighter editing, it gets kind of tiresome in many parts... but the basic fundamental observation seems right to me and helps give me the mental models to recognize and describe it. "it" being the way in the internet economy those who occupy that "middleman" position can become "chokepoints" who can hold both consumers and producers hostage. Or, as Doctorow wrote in a blog post covering some similar ground: > Here is how platforms die: first, they are good to their users; then they abuse their users to make things better for their business customers; finally, they abuse those business customers to claw back all the value for themselves. Then, they die. — https://pluralistic.net/2023/01/21/potemkin-ai/ https://pluralistic.net/2023/01/21/potemkin-ai/ I'm not sure if they all die, there are a LOT of platforms around which haven't died yet, but those first steps are very recognizable in chokepoint middlemen like Spotify is for music and is trying to become for podcasts. First you give both consumers and the "business customers" (whether podcast producers or product sellers on Amazon) a great deal; then, once you've locked the consumers in you make the deal for consumers a lot worse in order to keep your business customers on your side; then, once you've locked _them_ in too (perhaps because they need you to reach the consumers, who are all on your platform), you tighten things up for business customers too, trying to extract as much money as possible from consumers and share as little of it as possible with the producers, while both have a hard time leaving you due to network effects. So, yeah, it always starts great for your users. This is how you trap them, so you can then start tightening the screws.
cccybernetic 4y ago
I find your phrasing and mindset interesting. What you suggest somewhat maliciously as "lock others in at high rates", I read as "shower them with more cash than they could ever conceivably dream of" I'd love if my employer "locked me in" at a higher rate lol.

crossroadsguy 4y ago

You are on iPhone or Android? Or some other platform? Because on these platforms if I list best 4 podcast apps, Spotify won’t come within miles of that short list. I am slowly decreasing my use of Spotify because of the way it’s pushing podcasts while all I want is music from it. Nothing else.

cccybernetic 4y ago
iPhone - I'm happy to take recommendations.
- ryeights 4y ago
  Pocket Casts is what I use, lots of useful features like silence trimming, voice amplification, organizational tools, chapters, and programmable skipping of intro ads. Recently open-sourced as well.
- ndiddy 4y ago
  Castro is my favorite.
- sleepybrett 4y ago
  i like overcast
- dagw 4y ago
  Having tried most podcast apps, I always come back to Pocketcast.
dotBen 4y ago
I am slowly decreasing my use of Spotify because of the way it’s pushing podcasts while all I want is music from it. Best thing to do is actually to pay for Spotify and use it regularly, but never touch the podcasts. They have metrics and usage logging all over the app and they will know over time how few paying subscribers are listening to Joe Rogan et al. They'll soon give him the can if they know there's lower engagement than expected for the price being paid.

Adraghast 4y ago

> Also, I've tried 4 different podcast players and they're all terrible except for Spotify's. You’re the first person I’ve heard with anything positive to say about their podcast UI, so I’m really curious what those four are.

cccybernetic 4y ago
"Terrible" was too strong of a word -- I actually like Overcast, but find Spotify superior.
eastbound 4y ago
> so I’m really curious what those four are. Apple’s podcasts app goes out of its way to avoid showing the tracklist of the current channel or the list of recently played podcasts, or to make you misclick on the little channel name which changes the current track (given that you can’t list the recently played, any misclick is a major annoyance). I think they might have hired a AUX, an “anti-user experience” engineer.
- mrcwinn 4y ago
  I use Apple Podcasts every day and experience none of these problems. Maybe give it another try if and when Spotify’s extra layer on ad logos and banners wears on you.
  - hnzix 4y ago
    Trying to setup chronological podcast playback on the Apple Podcast is horrible, and they are constantly fiddling with the terrible UI. I just want to binge 5 consecutive episodes of a history podcast, but everything in the UI tries to funnel you into listening to the latest episode of multiple podcasts.
    - mr_toad 4y ago
      It also seems to be impossible to get it to automatically download episodes in chronological order. It only wants to download new episodes. So if you run out of downloaded episodes it will skip forward to the new episodes, which could be years apart.

budu3 4y ago

The Google Podcasts app works for me. It has a minimalist feel to it.

josephd79 4y ago

Have you tried overcast?

pnutjam 4y ago

I used "Podcast Republic" for a long time, but it recently started downloading stuff automatically and I can't figure out how to tell it to stop. It filled up my storage with junk podcasts where I subscribed, but only listened to intermittently. So, I had to switch to spotify because it doesn't do that. I don't need to listen offline as much recently, since I wfh.