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> can make people dizzy and drowsy LMFAO vinyl chloride is a multi-organ carcinogen...its literally one of the quickest ways to stage 4 right up there with Ben

> can make people dizzy and drowsy LMFAO vinyl chloride is a multi-organ carcinogen...its literally one of the quickest ways to stage 4 right up there with Benzene exposure. phosgene was also part of the release when Ohio decided a "controlled burn" of the vinyl chloride was somehow a good idea. the plume could be seen from commercial flights. honest to god the damage control media outlets are attempting in the midst of what by every definition is just under a massive environmental disaster is just ridiculous. If this happened in China it would be front page news.

gwright 4y ago
> honest to god the damage control media outlets are attempting in the midst of what by every definition is just under a massive environmental disaster is just ridiculous. If this happened in China it would be front page news. Is it damage control or just some strange calculation that it isn't a story that will attract page views? Both rationales are concerning, but they suggest different pathologies in our media ecosystem.
- shadowgovt 4y ago
  It's honestly that there's not much story because it looks worse than it is. Chemicals are counter-intuitive. People don't have a good match for looks-scary to is-scary. I watch the Checmical Safety Board incident report videos from time-to-time. The most common killer in chemical plants? Carbon monoxide: odorless, colorless, tasteless, and simply displaces oxygen. You climb into an enclosed space, have just enough time to realize something's wrong (maybe) before you pass out, and never wake up. The methyl isocyanate that killed in Bhopal rolled along the ground creating a silent blanket of death. A giant black plume climbing into the cloud layer is scary looking but in no way correlated, one way or another, with the actual risk to public safety. Made for great 6 o'clock news footage, but the followup story really is just "Clean the soot off your house and maybe check your basement for any chemical that rolled away before it burned."
  - qikInNdOutReply 4y ago
    [flagged]
    - shadowgovt 4y ago
      You say that like I don't live in sight of the plume, friend. I've been volunteered. ;) I have more concern living in this part of the country about the lead in my pipes than the contents of that cloud.
    - LarryMullins 4y ago
      Exactly this. Nobody claiming this shit is safe will put their lives where their mouths are. Nobody in this thread moaning about people not trusting the experts will consider moving their families into this town to show the rest of us how trustworthy they really think the government is.
      - shadowgovt 4y ago
        Does me not moving out of town count? ;)
xadhominemx 4y ago
> LMFAO vinyl chloride is a multi-organ carcinogen...its literally one of the quickest ways to stage 4 right up there with Benzene exposure. No it’s not
- yebyen 4y ago
  https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-prevention/risk/substances/vinyl-chloride https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-prevention/risk/s... > Vinyl chloride exposure is associated with an increased risk of a rare form of liver cancer (hepatic angiosarcoma), as well as primary liver cancer (hepatocellular carcinoma), brain and lung cancers, lymphoma, and leukemia. If there's some fact in the parent comment which is in dispute could you please be a bit more clear about what it is? This is a very unhelpful comment from you.
  - xadhominemx 4y ago
    Don’t chide me. Parent comment is ridiculous and harmful fearmongering and hyperbole. Read your own link - there is no mention of carcinogenicity* from acute exposure and environmental a biological persistence is very low. I would be more concerned if I spent a career in a vinyl chloride production facility without proper ppe.
    - shkkmo 4y ago
      There is no language in that link that limits the risks to long term exposure. If you follow the OSHA link on that page, you'll see that the ERPG-3 is 20000 ppm; that's the level at which some people will start facing lethal complications after an hour of exposure. If you're gonna argue that there are no consequences to acute exposure, you gonna have to provide some sources.
      - xadhominemx 4y ago
        20,000 ppm! Do you understand how high that is??
JKCalhoun 4y ago
> the damage control media outlets are attempting That suggests intent. While I am as cynical as the next person I wouldn't make a claim like that without also citing evidence to back it up.
- yunwal 4y ago
  Time and time again, even media sources that we're told are trustworthy and rigorous show that they'll shill for corporate interests if given enough financial incentive and a promising enough narrative[0][1][2][3][4]. At what point do we just assume that financial conflict of interest is inherent in how media reports on issues? [0] - https://www.coindesk.com/layer2/2022/11/15/lets-talk-about-the-new-york-times-puff-piece-on-sam-bankman-fried/ https://www.coindesk.com/layer2/2022/11/15/lets-talk-about-t... [1] - https://theintercept.com/2022/08/17/new-york-times-dan-goldman-endorsement-mondaire-jones/ https://theintercept.com/2022/08/17/new-york-times-dan-goldm... [2] - https://theintercept.com/2016/01/29/nyt-outside-spending/ https://theintercept.com/2016/01/29/nyt-outside-spending/ [3] - https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/05/16/democrats-need-more-tough-love-economy-inflation-greedflation-biden/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/05/16/democrats... [4] - https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/tax-bezos-help-workers-but-not-like-this/2018/09/06/9ebd64ae-b20d-11e8-aed9-001309990777_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/tax-bezos-help-worke...
gowings97 4y ago
Our fearless US press is too scared to have on-site staff to cover the largest ecological land-based disaster since Three Mile Island. Or they've been told by the regime it's a non-issue? Not sure which is worse, but the outcome is what you see before you; back page coverage a week after the incident. Barely a blurb. Yes, these things take time to fully investigate. Where are the daily updates from the EPA though? Why aren't the major news outlets syndicating these daily EPA updates? This is relevant to more Americans than the war in Ukraine, which many news outlets have a dedicated section for in the header section (Business, World, Sports, etc.) I just checked US News & World Report and CNN front pages - not even listed.
- gruez 4y ago
  >Our fearless US press is too scared to have on-site staff to cover the largest ecological land-based disaster since Three Mile Island According to whom? Looking at this list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Environmental_disasters_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Environmental_disaste..., it's not hard to find incidents that were arguably worse, eg. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Dan_River_coal_ash_spill https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Dan_River_coal_ash_spill or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Gold_King_Mine_waste_water_spill https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Gold_King_Mine_waste_wate...
  - gowings97 4y ago
    "...the outcome is what you see before you; back page/hardly any coverage a week after the incident. Nothing on the front pages a week after the incident. Barely a blurb." If they're there, whatever work they're doing is not making it onto front pages. The alternative explanation (subtext from the description above) is more likely - most major news outlets have not sent a journalist to cover this, neither are they covering EPA updates. If they were, why is their work not receiving daily updates on the news outlet front pages?
- anigbrowl 4y ago
  Before you mock the press maybe take a look at how they are being treated in Ohio. This is from a press conference given by the governor last week. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQMLxBpiSu8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQMLxBpiSu8
sct202 4y ago
No need for a conspiracy when the spy balloons (Jan 28th) and Turkish earthquake (Jan 6) happened concurrently (Feb 3 initial derailment, Feb 6 for giant black smoke from controlled release).
Accujack 4y ago
Do you know how much phosgene, though? It's trace amounts. Barely enough to detect.

gwright 4y ago

> honest to god the damage control media outlets are attempting in the midst of what by every definition is just under a massive environmental disaster is just ridiculous. If this happened in China it would be front page news. Is it damage control or just some strange calculation that it isn't a story that will attract page views? Both rationales are concerning, but they suggest different pathologies in our media ecosystem.

shadowgovt 4y ago
It's honestly that there's not much story because it looks worse than it is. Chemicals are counter-intuitive. People don't have a good match for looks-scary to is-scary. I watch the Checmical Safety Board incident report videos from time-to-time. The most common killer in chemical plants? Carbon monoxide: odorless, colorless, tasteless, and simply displaces oxygen. You climb into an enclosed space, have just enough time to realize something's wrong (maybe) before you pass out, and never wake up. The methyl isocyanate that killed in Bhopal rolled along the ground creating a silent blanket of death. A giant black plume climbing into the cloud layer is scary looking but in no way correlated, one way or another, with the actual risk to public safety. Made for great 6 o'clock news footage, but the followup story really is just "Clean the soot off your house and maybe check your basement for any chemical that rolled away before it burned."
- qikInNdOutReply 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - shadowgovt 4y ago
    You say that like I don't live in sight of the plume, friend. I've been volunteered. ;) I have more concern living in this part of the country about the lead in my pipes than the contents of that cloud.
  - LarryMullins 4y ago
    Exactly this. Nobody claiming this shit is safe will put their lives where their mouths are. Nobody in this thread moaning about people not trusting the experts will consider moving their families into this town to show the rest of us how trustworthy they really think the government is.
    - shadowgovt 4y ago
      Does me not moving out of town count? ;)

xadhominemx 4y ago

> LMFAO vinyl chloride is a multi-organ carcinogen...its literally one of the quickest ways to stage 4 right up there with Benzene exposure. No it’s not

yebyen 4y ago
https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-prevention/risk/substances/vinyl-chloride https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-prevention/risk/s... > Vinyl chloride exposure is associated with an increased risk of a rare form of liver cancer (hepatic angiosarcoma), as well as primary liver cancer (hepatocellular carcinoma), brain and lung cancers, lymphoma, and leukemia. If there's some fact in the parent comment which is in dispute could you please be a bit more clear about what it is? This is a very unhelpful comment from you.
- xadhominemx 4y ago
  Don’t chide me. Parent comment is ridiculous and harmful fearmongering and hyperbole. Read your own link - there is no mention of carcinogenicity* from acute exposure and environmental a biological persistence is very low. I would be more concerned if I spent a career in a vinyl chloride production facility without proper ppe.
  - shkkmo 4y ago
    There is no language in that link that limits the risks to long term exposure. If you follow the OSHA link on that page, you'll see that the ERPG-3 is 20000 ppm; that's the level at which some people will start facing lethal complications after an hour of exposure. If you're gonna argue that there are no consequences to acute exposure, you gonna have to provide some sources.
    - xadhominemx 4y ago
      20,000 ppm! Do you understand how high that is??

JKCalhoun 4y ago

> the damage control media outlets are attempting That suggests intent. While I am as cynical as the next person I wouldn't make a claim like that without also citing evidence to back it up.

yunwal 4y ago
Time and time again, even media sources that we're told are trustworthy and rigorous show that they'll shill for corporate interests if given enough financial incentive and a promising enough narrative[0][1][2][3][4]. At what point do we just assume that financial conflict of interest is inherent in how media reports on issues? [0] - https://www.coindesk.com/layer2/2022/11/15/lets-talk-about-the-new-york-times-puff-piece-on-sam-bankman-fried/ https://www.coindesk.com/layer2/2022/11/15/lets-talk-about-t... [1] - https://theintercept.com/2022/08/17/new-york-times-dan-goldman-endorsement-mondaire-jones/ https://theintercept.com/2022/08/17/new-york-times-dan-goldm... [2] - https://theintercept.com/2016/01/29/nyt-outside-spending/ https://theintercept.com/2016/01/29/nyt-outside-spending/ [3] - https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/05/16/democrats-need-more-tough-love-economy-inflation-greedflation-biden/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/05/16/democrats... [4] - https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/tax-bezos-help-workers-but-not-like-this/2018/09/06/9ebd64ae-b20d-11e8-aed9-001309990777_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/tax-bezos-help-worke...

gowings97 4y ago

Our fearless US press is too scared to have on-site staff to cover the largest ecological land-based disaster since Three Mile Island. Or they've been told by the regime it's a non-issue? Not sure which is worse, but the outcome is what you see before you; back page coverage a week after the incident. Barely a blurb. Yes, these things take time to fully investigate. Where are the daily updates from the EPA though? Why aren't the major news outlets syndicating these daily EPA updates? This is relevant to more Americans than the war in Ukraine, which many news outlets have a dedicated section for in the header section (Business, World, Sports, etc.) I just checked US News & World Report and CNN front pages - not even listed.

gruez 4y ago
>Our fearless US press is too scared to have on-site staff to cover the largest ecological land-based disaster since Three Mile Island According to whom? Looking at this list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Environmental_disasters_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Environmental_disaste..., it's not hard to find incidents that were arguably worse, eg. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Dan_River_coal_ash_spill https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Dan_River_coal_ash_spill or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Gold_King_Mine_waste_water_spill https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Gold_King_Mine_waste_wate...
- gowings97 4y ago
  "...the outcome is what you see before you; back page/hardly any coverage a week after the incident. Nothing on the front pages a week after the incident. Barely a blurb." If they're there, whatever work they're doing is not making it onto front pages. The alternative explanation (subtext from the description above) is more likely - most major news outlets have not sent a journalist to cover this, neither are they covering EPA updates. If they were, why is their work not receiving daily updates on the news outlet front pages?
anigbrowl 4y ago
Before you mock the press maybe take a look at how they are being treated in Ohio. This is from a press conference given by the governor last week. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQMLxBpiSu8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQMLxBpiSu8

sct202 4y ago

No need for a conspiracy when the spy balloons (Jan 28th) and Turkish earthquake (Jan 6) happened concurrently (Feb 3 initial derailment, Feb 6 for giant black smoke from controlled release).

Accujack 4y ago

Do you know how much phosgene, though? It's trace amounts. Barely enough to detect.