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Not all managers are that involved in implementation details. My experience is that most managers value deliverables: new features for users. Software engineers

by mcv 4y ago

Not all managers are that involved in implementation details. My experience is that most managers value deliverables: new features for users. Software engineers value good structure and reducing technical debt. Good managers listen to their engineers and let them tackle tech debt, and smart engineers tell managers that tackling tech means they can deliver new features faster and more reliably in the future.

jahewson 4y ago
> Software engineers value good structure and reducing technical debt A small minority of them do. As far as I can tell what most software engineers value is the act of writing code.
- mcv 4y ago
  Well alright. I value the act of writing pretty code. But in many teams, I often see managers wanting more features, while I frequently see the devs argue for taking some time to address technical debt. Maybe there's some selection bias in me always being one of those devs.
- aflag 4y ago
  In my experience most developers just want to reduce the cognitive load as much as possible. That sometimes means rewriting a lot of things so they make sense to them.
- maximus-decimus 4y ago
  I value good software. I ENJOY writing code.
Lutger 4y ago
Managers do value the value of solving technical debt, because ultimately these changes maintain and improve the ability to deliver features. The problem is they often are unable to see how technical improvements affect the capacity to deliver. It doesn't help that developers also sometimes can't see it, and make mistakes overengineering or improving something that is of little value. In this sense it is a bit like the prevention paradox during the pandemic. If you are successful in preventing an outbreak, people will hate you for it because most people only feel the pain of the measures they had to take, and the absence of an outbreak only shows them those measures were useless. Then, to worsen things, there are also genuine mistakes in handling the pandemic and those are forever used as proof the measures are useless and its proponents incompetent. It really takes a lot of discernment to cut through all this.
logn 4y ago
This is my experience with good managers but also that they sympathize with the difficulties and successes of design and implementation otherwise they'll act in a way the hurts morale. Here it helps being a former individual contributor in the role being managed.

by mcv 4y ago

jahewson 4y ago

> Software engineers value good structure and reducing technical debt A small minority of them do. As far as I can tell what most software engineers value is the act of writing code.

mcv 4y ago
Well alright. I value the act of writing pretty code. But in many teams, I often see managers wanting more features, while I frequently see the devs argue for taking some time to address technical debt. Maybe there's some selection bias in me always being one of those devs.
aflag 4y ago
In my experience most developers just want to reduce the cognitive load as much as possible. That sometimes means rewriting a lot of things so they make sense to them.
maximus-decimus 4y ago
I value good software. I ENJOY writing code.

Lutger 4y ago

Managers do value the value of solving technical debt, because ultimately these changes maintain and improve the ability to deliver features. The problem is they often are unable to see how technical improvements affect the capacity to deliver. It doesn't help that developers also sometimes can't see it, and make mistakes overengineering or improving something that is of little value. In this sense it is a bit like the prevention paradox during the pandemic. If you are successful in preventing an outbreak, people will hate you for it because most people only feel the pain of the measures they had to take, and the absence of an outbreak only shows them those measures were useless. Then, to worsen things, there are also genuine mistakes in handling the pandemic and those are forever used as proof the measures are useless and its proponents incompetent. It really takes a lot of discernment to cut through all this.

logn 4y ago

This is my experience with good managers but also that they sympathize with the difficulties and successes of design and implementation otherwise they'll act in a way the hurts morale. Here it helps being a former individual contributor in the role being managed.