3 ms·

By September Putin would have been able to see the writing on the wall. Germany was not caving on sanctions and they were clearly expediting a post Russia energ

By September Putin would have been able to see the writing on the wall. Germany was not caving on sanctions and they were clearly expediting a post Russia energy future. Also, are you deliberately changing what Biden said about ending (specifically) Nordstream 2 to “the Nordstreams” to make it seem more believable that he was referring to physical destruction rather than stopping the non-operational Nordstream from progressing to operational status?

ajsnigrutin 4y ago
> expediting a post Russia energy future. Meaning what exactly? Very expensive gas, and in turn heat, and local factories closing down? Politicians can shit around all day, factories need cheap gas to work, people need jobs in those factories to be able to eat and heat their homes and heat is more expensive than ever.
- avmich 4y ago
  People first need safety, and only after that working factories, and there's tremendous suspicion in Europe that here we have a replay of sad events some 80 years ago. Politicians can shit all day, and people can be gullible as worms, yet sometime they add two with two and figure out that spending more today and changing the energy sources for tomorrow may save them from having to spend all and above to maintain the defense after the previous guy separating them from problems will fail. Talking about jobs and factories one shouldn't forget about safety.
  - ajsnigrutin 4y ago
    For "the rest of the world", the "sad events" have been happening literally right now, or during the last 80 years... syria, libya, afghanistan, iraq, iraq again, yemen, yugoslavia, etc., but since it was "us" doing it, no sanctions were needed, and dead civilians didn't count. Syria is occupied right now by americans and you're shitting here about safety... Price Harry even went playing "war tourism" and went shooting afghani farmers and bragged about it... France has been fucking up africa for centuries too. I live in a shitty small slovenia, and even we sent soldiers to help the agressors in afghanistan and syria. But yes, overinflated politicians are bragging about europe being civilization and everywhere else being a jungle... so yeah, maybe it's time for yankee/European to go home and keep for them/ourselves. If we don't, we have no moral superiority to blame putin for anything while our own soldiers are occupying foreign sovereign countries this very moment.
    - ghostwriter 4y ago
      > I live in a shitty small slovenia, and even we sent soldiers to help the agressors in afghanistan and syria. Fun facts: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5th_Mechanized_Brigade_(Ukraine) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5th_Mechanized_Brigade_(Ukrain... * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6th_Mechanized_Brigade_(Ukraine) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6th_Mechanized_Brigade_(Ukrain...
    - avmich 4y ago
      I don't agree that some of your statements are facts. However, pretty much all countries have unjust conflicts in their history, where they were on the wrong side. That doesn't mean it should continue. I'll refrain from commenting on Syria topic - I feel it justifies better facts on the table and longer discussion than this place allows. You may think what you want. Maybe it's time for many countries to keep to themselves - that would roughly correspond to Westfall sovereignty, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westphalian_sovereignty https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westphalian_sovereignty . Or maybe we should be of the opinion that certain things, like human rights, aren't the matter of countries, and have some ways of supporting them too. > If we don't, we have no moral superiority to blame putin for anything while our own soldiers are occupying foreign sovereign countries this very moment. Why?
      - ajsnigrutin 4y ago
        > However, pretty much all countries have unjust conflicts in their history, where they were on the wrong side. That doesn't mean it should continue. We're not talking about far away history... we're talking about our soldiers occupying foreign sovereign countries right now, today. This is not a germany WW2 situation, where they got fucked, repaid some of the damage, said that they won't repeat history and two generations went by... this is literally today. If we wanted to be better than putin, there's 1 year (minus 11 days) gone by, with us pointing a finger, while we're doing the same... 1 year (almost) that we had the time to "be better", and leave the occupied countriey... but we didn't. > Or maybe we should be of the opinion that certain things, like human rights, aren't the matter of countries, and have some ways of supporting them too. Lets be real... noone cares about human rights. At least not enough to start a war. Do people have a right for police not to steal their stuff? Not in america (civil asset forfeiture). The british have arrested more people for "wronghink" (on social media) than the "bad bad putin" did. Guantanamo bay is still there. And zelensky is banning political parties, tv stations and a whole church now. Noone cares about all that. This is just a nice excuse to start a war where you need one... usually in places with either natural resources or strategic location. Find someone to testify about soldiers killing babies, bam war. Need a better story for the second time? Just use weapons of mass destruction excuse.. and then a few years later a "whoopsie, we fucked up". Where are the human rights of the people prince harry killed when he went on his killing tourism? > Why? Because we're the same. Counting the number of wars and dead people, even worse.

ajsnigrutin 4y ago

> expediting a post Russia energy future. Meaning what exactly? Very expensive gas, and in turn heat, and local factories closing down? Politicians can shit around all day, factories need cheap gas to work, people need jobs in those factories to be able to eat and heat their homes and heat is more expensive than ever.

avmich 4y ago
People first need safety, and only after that working factories, and there's tremendous suspicion in Europe that here we have a replay of sad events some 80 years ago. Politicians can shit all day, and people can be gullible as worms, yet sometime they add two with two and figure out that spending more today and changing the energy sources for tomorrow may save them from having to spend all and above to maintain the defense after the previous guy separating them from problems will fail. Talking about jobs and factories one shouldn't forget about safety.
- ajsnigrutin 4y ago
  For "the rest of the world", the "sad events" have been happening literally right now, or during the last 80 years... syria, libya, afghanistan, iraq, iraq again, yemen, yugoslavia, etc., but since it was "us" doing it, no sanctions were needed, and dead civilians didn't count. Syria is occupied right now by americans and you're shitting here about safety... Price Harry even went playing "war tourism" and went shooting afghani farmers and bragged about it... France has been fucking up africa for centuries too. I live in a shitty small slovenia, and even we sent soldiers to help the agressors in afghanistan and syria. But yes, overinflated politicians are bragging about europe being civilization and everywhere else being a jungle... so yeah, maybe it's time for yankee/European to go home and keep for them/ourselves. If we don't, we have no moral superiority to blame putin for anything while our own soldiers are occupying foreign sovereign countries this very moment.
  - ghostwriter 4y ago
    > I live in a shitty small slovenia, and even we sent soldiers to help the agressors in afghanistan and syria. Fun facts: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5th_Mechanized_Brigade_(Ukraine) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5th_Mechanized_Brigade_(Ukrain... * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6th_Mechanized_Brigade_(Ukraine) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6th_Mechanized_Brigade_(Ukrain...
  - avmich 4y ago
    I don't agree that some of your statements are facts. However, pretty much all countries have unjust conflicts in their history, where they were on the wrong side. That doesn't mean it should continue. I'll refrain from commenting on Syria topic - I feel it justifies better facts on the table and longer discussion than this place allows. You may think what you want. Maybe it's time for many countries to keep to themselves - that would roughly correspond to Westfall sovereignty, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westphalian_sovereignty https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westphalian_sovereignty . Or maybe we should be of the opinion that certain things, like human rights, aren't the matter of countries, and have some ways of supporting them too. > If we don't, we have no moral superiority to blame putin for anything while our own soldiers are occupying foreign sovereign countries this very moment. Why?
    - ajsnigrutin 4y ago
      > However, pretty much all countries have unjust conflicts in their history, where they were on the wrong side. That doesn't mean it should continue. We're not talking about far away history... we're talking about our soldiers occupying foreign sovereign countries right now, today. This is not a germany WW2 situation, where they got fucked, repaid some of the damage, said that they won't repeat history and two generations went by... this is literally today. If we wanted to be better than putin, there's 1 year (minus 11 days) gone by, with us pointing a finger, while we're doing the same... 1 year (almost) that we had the time to "be better", and leave the occupied countriey... but we didn't. > Or maybe we should be of the opinion that certain things, like human rights, aren't the matter of countries, and have some ways of supporting them too. Lets be real... noone cares about human rights. At least not enough to start a war. Do people have a right for police not to steal their stuff? Not in america (civil asset forfeiture). The british have arrested more people for "wronghink" (on social media) than the "bad bad putin" did. Guantanamo bay is still there. And zelensky is banning political parties, tv stations and a whole church now. Noone cares about all that. This is just a nice excuse to start a war where you need one... usually in places with either natural resources or strategic location. Find someone to testify about soldiers killing babies, bam war. Need a better story for the second time? Just use weapons of mass destruction excuse.. and then a few years later a "whoopsie, we fucked up". Where are the human rights of the people prince harry killed when he went on his killing tourism? > Why? Because we're the same. Counting the number of wars and dead people, even worse.