5 ms·

Can’t possibly discount the possibility that this is FUD put out by the pharmaceutical industry to counterweight the increased openness to psychedelics, in part

Can’t possibly discount the possibility that this is FUD put out by the pharmaceutical industry to counterweight the increased openness to psychedelics, in part from Pollan’s How to Change Your Mind book and Netflix series. My experience has been that with proper set and setting, I got months of relief from a good psychedelic experience. Shrooms. My first mushroom trip I had tears streaming down my face for something like two hours- but there was such profound relief along with it, like I was feeling and letting go of decades of the sorts of things that get a person a complex trauma diagnosis. I’ve tried LSD; it was more cerebral whereas shrooms had a more emotional component. LSD didn’t provide that sort of relief. But the visuals were stunning (which, while newt to experience, isn’t what I was hoping for). Also tried ketamine sessions at my primary care dr’s office. Did not like it; during the trip, which seemed to have a duration of eternity, I was a disembodied consciousness considering my life. I could genuinely see this as being somewhere between disconcerting and alarming as hell to a first -timer. Also, it wasn’t particularly cathartic and the clinical setting was an unwelcome distraction.

emodendroket 4y ago
I'm sure you could find some unhappy trip experiences on erowid if you believe it is literally impossible that anyone could have a negative experience.
- jungledeuce 4y ago
  I had a single terrible experience with dissociatives, to the point that for many many years I had ongoing panic attacks. It was an absolute nightmare for a long time as I was never sure when one might strike. Without data it’s hard to say how dangerous these drugs are, but they are dangerous. People will pipe in with how you need the right setting and mindset and on and on, it’s never the drug it’s always the patient. But even if that’s all true, none of that is objectively verifiable, people will still have terrible, life-changing experiences, and we should better understand the rate at which they will before prescribing it broadly.
- htag 4y ago
  A piece can be both FUD and true. In fact, often times the more truth that is in the piece the better it can be at sowing fear, uncertainty and doubt. 1. The author admits there was not a long term negative impact on his treatment. 2. People have negative reactions to depression treatments every day. Many of them are much worse. Virtually none of them end up in the washington post. 3. Untreated depression can have a much worse outcome than this treatment had on this patient. 4. This article provides no statistical information required to accurately judge the effectiveness of the treatment, or to compare it to other depression treatments, or to compare it to untreated depression. If this data showed a bleak view of ketamine treatment I think it would have been included in the article, given it's tone.
  - emodendroket 4y ago
    Point 4 is untrue. > Where does that leave me? According to reputable studies, ketamine can be life-changing for a significant majority — as much as three-quarters — of those who take it for depression. That leaves 25 percent, like me, who are not so fortunate. > I asked John Krystal, chief of psychiatry and behavioral health at Yale-New Haven Hospital and a leading authority on ketamine use for depression, about my experience. “There is a risk that some patients will have extremely upsetting experiences during treatment [with] ketamine or psychedelics,” he said. “The experience of losing control of the form and content of their thought processes and the altered sensory experiences are, themselves, potentially traumatic experiences.”
- electric_mayhem 4y ago
  Where did I say that it was “literally impossible that anyone could have a negative experience”? Straw man much?
  - emodendroket 4y ago
    If the very fact that someone tried it and had a negative experience is dubious in your mind then that would follow.
Overtonwindow 4y ago
>whereas shrooms had a more emotional component. I believe others call it "ego death" but for me, in all seriousness, it was like being red-pilled. With shrooms I suddenly saw the world clearly, without emotion, without depression or anxiety. It was the "gateway" that gave me the confidence that a pathway existed to a life without depression.. That led to ketamine therapy and remission.
tptacek 4y ago
I hereby discount the possibility that this article is FUD put out by the pharmaceutical industry.

emodendroket 4y ago

I'm sure you could find some unhappy trip experiences on erowid if you believe it is literally impossible that anyone could have a negative experience.

jungledeuce 4y ago
I had a single terrible experience with dissociatives, to the point that for many many years I had ongoing panic attacks. It was an absolute nightmare for a long time as I was never sure when one might strike. Without data it’s hard to say how dangerous these drugs are, but they are dangerous. People will pipe in with how you need the right setting and mindset and on and on, it’s never the drug it’s always the patient. But even if that’s all true, none of that is objectively verifiable, people will still have terrible, life-changing experiences, and we should better understand the rate at which they will before prescribing it broadly.
htag 4y ago
A piece can be both FUD and true. In fact, often times the more truth that is in the piece the better it can be at sowing fear, uncertainty and doubt. 1. The author admits there was not a long term negative impact on his treatment. 2. People have negative reactions to depression treatments every day. Many of them are much worse. Virtually none of them end up in the washington post. 3. Untreated depression can have a much worse outcome than this treatment had on this patient. 4. This article provides no statistical information required to accurately judge the effectiveness of the treatment, or to compare it to other depression treatments, or to compare it to untreated depression. If this data showed a bleak view of ketamine treatment I think it would have been included in the article, given it's tone.
- emodendroket 4y ago
  Point 4 is untrue. > Where does that leave me? According to reputable studies, ketamine can be life-changing for a significant majority — as much as three-quarters — of those who take it for depression. That leaves 25 percent, like me, who are not so fortunate. > I asked John Krystal, chief of psychiatry and behavioral health at Yale-New Haven Hospital and a leading authority on ketamine use for depression, about my experience. “There is a risk that some patients will have extremely upsetting experiences during treatment [with] ketamine or psychedelics,” he said. “The experience of losing control of the form and content of their thought processes and the altered sensory experiences are, themselves, potentially traumatic experiences.”
electric_mayhem 4y ago
Where did I say that it was “literally impossible that anyone could have a negative experience”? Straw man much?
- emodendroket 4y ago
  If the very fact that someone tried it and had a negative experience is dubious in your mind then that would follow.

Overtonwindow 4y ago

>whereas shrooms had a more emotional component. I believe others call it "ego death" but for me, in all seriousness, it was like being red-pilled. With shrooms I suddenly saw the world clearly, without emotion, without depression or anxiety. It was the "gateway" that gave me the confidence that a pathway existed to a life without depression.. That led to ketamine therapy and remission.

tptacek 4y ago

I hereby discount the possibility that this article is FUD put out by the pharmaceutical industry.