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I guess you didn't read the article the linked to the study showing most working age adults on EBT actually have jobs. Those jobs just don't pay enough to survi

I guess you didn't read the article the linked to the study showing most working age adults on EBT actually have jobs. Those jobs just don't pay enough to survive (ie, food+rent). That's a relatively new trend that didn't exist back during your formative years. Anyway, it is a slash because the economic ramifications of the pandemic haven't ended. Food prices spiked dramatically because of it and have not gone down. They are continuing to go up. It's unfortunate that people who suffered generally want other people to have to suffer like they did. What you're describing is not a happy, uplifting story of bootstraps. 8 year olds having jobs is sad.

ghiculescu 4y ago
OP said shining shoes was their idea, and the money was used to buy something cool. Presumably not every family could afford a telescope. I think 8 year olds finding ways to make pocket money is awesome, not sad. (8 year olds needing to work to provide for their themselves or family is, of course, sad.)
- superkuh 4y ago
  OP brought it up in a thread explicitly about EBT. It's extremely clear what he was trying to say. If he was just talking about pocket money then what was the point in bringing it up?
  - ghiculescu 4y ago
    Because it gives context to OP’s worldview, and opinions presented in the first two paragraphs.
colechristensen 4y ago
Giving working people money ultimately subsidizes shitty employers and landlords making it more likely that low income employed people will need to get government assistance. I’m not saying you shouldn’t do it and other things as well, but such programs have other consequences. I’m a fan of the opposite angle, using zoning laws to force the construction of large amounts of high density large apartments and then heavily taxing vacancies, think 4br 2k sq ft. (No empty buildings, no new construction made off entirely studios and 1br, ever shrinking). A glut of high rent properties to drive the prices of everything else down, and a reason for people with money not to run to the suburbs and keep income diversity in cities.
- gruez 4y ago
  > Giving working people money [...] making it more likely that low income employed people will need to get government assistance. Getting the government to give people money makes it more likely that people will get money from the government. Who would have thunk?
thinking4real 4y ago
[dead]
1letterunixname 4y ago
SNAP delivers single adults maybe about half of what they need to buy groceries, varying widely by locality and circumstances. The bootstrap myth continues: it's a modern misinterpretation of a metaphor for an impossible feat. It takes money from someone or somewhere else to get clothes, housing, water, food, and sanitation. It's a tale as old as time the segment of people who blame the unfortunate for their circumstances and insist they should help themselves by performing a miracle with nothing.
eggy 4y ago
I did read the article. My main point was that EBT was increased as an emergency measure, so it seems reasonable that it should return to the previous level before the pandemic. I realize the article makes a point about further cuts, and that is a different matter. I think 8-year-olds spending more time inside their house in front of a TV or tablet than a prisoner is much more tragic and sad than an industrious 8-year old who wants to go out and make life happen for themselves and not becoming an obese child to later develop hypertension and diabetes from being a couch potato. I don't want people to suffer. I don't know where you get that. I grew up without phones or TV in the 70s. I didn't know my childhood and crime-ridden neighborhood (highest in NYC for 8 years) would fill several Oprah shows. Aside from the intermittent violence, my friends and I were happy. Saving up for that telescope and working for things for myself created who I am today. And although anecdotal, I can tell you that seeing them turned in for cash for beer and cigarettes doesn't fit the rosy-glassed narrative of those who only read about it. I would also make the argument that I believe people also ate less. All of my working class neighbors were slim and generally fit from working manual labor and not eating today's large-sized portions. We have more than ever in this country than ever before, so to postulate that it's worse doesn't seem to fit my experience. I've also lived in a an Indonesian rice-farming village in Java for a year where 40% of the homes or more had dirt floors. I've traveled and lived in many other places for about 15% of my life, and self-reliance is not a myth, and it brings happiness and confidence to most people. I believe there are people that neither working for themselves or relying on others works for them, and this is truly sad, but not everyone can be saved from themselves or society.

ghiculescu 4y ago

OP said shining shoes was their idea, and the money was used to buy something cool. Presumably not every family could afford a telescope. I think 8 year olds finding ways to make pocket money is awesome, not sad. (8 year olds needing to work to provide for their themselves or family is, of course, sad.)

superkuh 4y ago
OP brought it up in a thread explicitly about EBT. It's extremely clear what he was trying to say. If he was just talking about pocket money then what was the point in bringing it up?
- ghiculescu 4y ago
  Because it gives context to OP’s worldview, and opinions presented in the first two paragraphs.

colechristensen 4y ago

Giving working people money ultimately subsidizes shitty employers and landlords making it more likely that low income employed people will need to get government assistance. I’m not saying you shouldn’t do it and other things as well, but such programs have other consequences. I’m a fan of the opposite angle, using zoning laws to force the construction of large amounts of high density large apartments and then heavily taxing vacancies, think 4br 2k sq ft. (No empty buildings, no new construction made off entirely studios and 1br, ever shrinking). A glut of high rent properties to drive the prices of everything else down, and a reason for people with money not to run to the suburbs and keep income diversity in cities.

gruez 4y ago
> Giving working people money [...] making it more likely that low income employed people will need to get government assistance. Getting the government to give people money makes it more likely that people will get money from the government. Who would have thunk?

thinking4real 4y ago

[dead]

1letterunixname 4y ago

SNAP delivers single adults maybe about half of what they need to buy groceries, varying widely by locality and circumstances. The bootstrap myth continues: it's a modern misinterpretation of a metaphor for an impossible feat. It takes money from someone or somewhere else to get clothes, housing, water, food, and sanitation. It's a tale as old as time the segment of people who blame the unfortunate for their circumstances and insist they should help themselves by performing a miracle with nothing.

eggy 4y ago

I did read the article. My main point was that EBT was increased as an emergency measure, so it seems reasonable that it should return to the previous level before the pandemic. I realize the article makes a point about further cuts, and that is a different matter. I think 8-year-olds spending more time inside their house in front of a TV or tablet than a prisoner is much more tragic and sad than an industrious 8-year old who wants to go out and make life happen for themselves and not becoming an obese child to later develop hypertension and diabetes from being a couch potato. I don't want people to suffer. I don't know where you get that. I grew up without phones or TV in the 70s. I didn't know my childhood and crime-ridden neighborhood (highest in NYC for 8 years) would fill several Oprah shows. Aside from the intermittent violence, my friends and I were happy. Saving up for that telescope and working for things for myself created who I am today. And although anecdotal, I can tell you that seeing them turned in for cash for beer and cigarettes doesn't fit the rosy-glassed narrative of those who only read about it. I would also make the argument that I believe people also ate less. All of my working class neighbors were slim and generally fit from working manual labor and not eating today's large-sized portions. We have more than ever in this country than ever before, so to postulate that it's worse doesn't seem to fit my experience. I've also lived in a an Indonesian rice-farming village in Java for a year where 40% of the homes or more had dirt floors. I've traveled and lived in many other places for about 15% of my life, and self-reliance is not a myth, and it brings happiness and confidence to most people. I believe there are people that neither working for themselves or relying on others works for them, and this is truly sad, but not everyone can be saved from themselves or society.