5 ms·

> The researchers also found one non-edible plant, henbane, which, in the past, was used for medicinal purposes. They always dance around hallucinogenic plants

• Pegasus930 4y ago
  [flagged]
  • Waterluvian 4y ago
    The comment didn’t say that they did drugs or that everyone does.
  • culi 4y ago
    If you're European you should know your ancestors likely settled down to practice agriculture in large part so they could drink a massive amount of alcohol
    • inglor_cz 4y ago
      Indeed it is not even clear whether "beer is a liquid bread" or "bread is a solid beer".
  • ssnistfajen 4y ago
    Alcoholic beverages existed for as long as agriculture itself. Cannabis use is found in many ancient civilizations. Just because you consider recreational drugs to be sanctimonious doesn't mean ancient humans shared the same arbitrary moral values as you.
• narrator 4y ago
  Henbane's active ingredient is scopolamine which, as with most strong anti-cholinergics, is a really bad trip. For Example: https://erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=110604 https://erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=110604
  • xen2xen1 4y ago
    Is that the ones that they call the zombie drug on the TV shows?
    • nszceta 4y ago
      Read post #2 https://bluelight.org/xf/threads/scopolamine.765088/ https://bluelight.org/xf/threads/scopolamine.765088/
    • narrator 4y ago
      It's used in parts of Latin America by thieves to rob people. They become delirious and detached from reality and will do whatever the thieves want. Circe also used it in the Odyssey to turn Odysseus's men into pigs. Odysseus prevented succumbing to Circe's poison by taking galantamine from the flowers of Galanthus nivalis, which is an acetylcholinesterase inhibitor. Galantamine counteracts the effects of anticholinergics by inhibiting the enzyme that breaks down acetylcholine.
      • yesenadam 4y ago
        > Circe also used it in the Odyssey to turn Odysseus's men into pigs. What's that based on? I can't seem to find any mention (in this translation at least) of what Circe used. Beyond just "evil drugs", "baneful drugs" etc. https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0136%3Abook%3D10%3Acard%3D208 https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext...
        • Amezarak 4y ago
          For some reason, in the humanities, especially with "pop" stuff like this, you can find a lot of extremely strong claims with basically zero backing. At any rate it's not a translation issue. You can see in your link, which also has the original Greek, that the phrase used is "pharmaka lugros", which means precisely what the translation said. Maybe there is some other tradition besides Homer that handed it down, but it's healthy to have a lot of skepticism with claims like this.
• dr_dshiv 4y ago
  Crazy but there is no historical evidence (text or images) of psilocybin mushroom use in Europe, prior to 1957. So hard to believe, but we simply don’t have evidence otherwise…
  • culi 4y ago
    What exactly does this even mean? The very origins of "Christmas" are from people drinking the piss of reindeer who have consumed Amanita muscaria. Amanita muscaria, while not of the Psilocybe genus, ~~contains psilocybin~~ (EDIT: it contains other psychedelic substances but no psilocybin) but (unlike Psilocybe mushrooms) is poisonous. The poison is neutralized in the reindeer piss so you can consume it to have a fun trip And Psilocybe themselves are global in distribution with hundreds of species. Almost all hallucinogenic and none are poisonous. A quick google search shows we have evidence for magic mushroom use in Europe for at least up to 6k years ago: https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg20928025-400-earliest-evidence-for-magic-mushroom-use-in-europe/ https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg20928025-400-earliest...
    • di456 4y ago
      > Amanita muscaria, while not of the Psilocybe genus, contains psilocybe This is misinformation. It contains ibotenic acid and muscimol. The effects are very different than psilocybin containing mushrooms. Reference on the chemical compounds: https://pharmacia.pensoft.net/article/56112/ https://pharmacia.pensoft.net/article/56112/
      • culi 4y ago
        Woops edited my comment, thanks. Either way my point was it's a psychedelic mushroom
    • riffraff 4y ago
      > The very origins of "Christmas" are from people drinking the piss of reindeer who have consumed Amanita muscaria I never heard of christmas deriving from reindeer, it is commonly associated with winter solstice, but given the first record of the festivity is in Rome in 336CE it seems odd. Maybe you mean the "association of reindeer with christmas", but that seems likely to have originated in the 19th century. Do you have any source?
• Alex3917 4y ago
  > They always dance around hallucinogenic plants. Just admit people have basically been dropping acid for centuries Because its medical use was for asthma. You could buy solanaceous cigarettes in the US until the 70s or so. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2844275/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2844275/
  • culi 4y ago
    With ethnobotanically medicinal plants there's almost always many uses for them: > Henbane is used in traditional herbal medicine for ailments of the bones, rheumatism, toothache, asthma, cough, nervous diseases, and stomach pain. It might also be used as analgesic, sedative, and narcotic in some cultures
    • daveguy 4y ago
      Wow. That's one hell of a cure all. I wonder why you don't see it for sale anymore.
      • mattkrause 4y ago
        It is! Scopolamine is on the WHO’s list of essential medicines.
      • culi 4y ago
        Like I said this isn't that surprising. In ethnobotany if a plant is medicinally important across many cultures like this it's usually a sure bet that there's a ton of interesting secondary metabolites with interesting properties being produced by that plant. These "highly medicinal plants" are actually quite common Some other examples of highly medicinal plants from PFAF: Ammi visnaga[^0] Visnaga is an effective muscle relaxant and has been used for centuries to alleviate the excruciating pain of kidney stones[254]. Modern research has confirmed the validity of this traditional use[254]. Visnagin contains khellin, from which particularly safe pharmaceutical drugs for the treatment of asthma have been made[254]. The seeds are diuretic and lithontripic[46]. They contain a fatty oil that includes the substance 'khellin'. This has been shown to be of benefit in the treatment of asthma[238]. Taken internally, the seeds have a strongly antispasmodic action on the smaller bronchial muscles[254], they also dilate the bronchial, urinary and blood vessels without affecting blood pressure[238]. The affect last for about 6 hours and the plant has practically no side effects[254]. The seeds are used in the treatment of asthma, angina, coronary arteriosclerosis and kidney stones[238]. By relaxing the muscles of the urethra, visnaga reduces the pain caused by trapped kidney stones and helps ease the stone down into the bladder[254]. The seeds are harvested in late summer before they have fully ripened and are dried for later use[254]. Cinchona pubescens[^1] Red bark has a long history of native use, especially as a treatment for fevers and malaria. Modern research has shown it to be a very effective treatment for fevers, and especially as a treatment and preventative of malaria. The bark contains various alkaloids, particularly quinine and quinidine. Up to 70 - 80% of the total alkaloids contained in the bark are quinine[ 418 ]. The bark is a bitter, astringent, tonic herb that lowers fevers, relaxes spasms, is antimalarial (the alkaloid quinine) and slows the heart (the alkaloid quinidine)[ 238 ]. The bark is made into various preparations, such as tablets, liquid extracts, tinctures and powders[ 238 ]. It is used internally in the treatment of malaria, neuralgia, muscle cramps and cardiac fibrillation[ 238 ]. It is an ingredient in various proprietary cold and influenza remedies[ 238 ]. The liquid extract is useful as a cure for drunkenness[ 418 ]. It is also used as a gargle to treat sore throats[ 238 ]. Care must be taken in the use of this herb since excess can cause a number of side effects including cinchonism, headache, rash, abdominal pain, deafness and blindness[ 238 ]. The herb, especially in the form of the extracted alkaloid quinine, is subject to legal restrictions in some countries[ 238 ]. Hamamelis virginiana[^2] Witch hazel bark is a traditional herb of the North American Indians who used it to heal wounds, treat tumours, eye problems etc[254]. A very astringent herb, it is commonly used in the West and is widely available from both herbalists and chemists[222]. It is an important ingredient of proprietary eye drops, skin creams, ointments and skin tonics[238]. It is widely used as an external application to bruises, sore muscles, varicose veins, haemorrhoids, sore nipples, inflammations etc[238]. The bark is astringent, haemostatic, sedative and tonic[4, 14, 21, 165, 171, 222]. Tannins in the bark are believed to be responsible for its astringent and haemostatic properties[222]. Bottled witch hazel water is a steam distillate that does not contain the tannins from the shrub[222], this is less effective in its action than a tincture[238]. The bark is used internally in the treatment of diarrhoea, colitis, dysentery, haemorrhoids, vaginal discharge, excessive menstruation, internal bleeding and prolapsed organs[238]. Branches and twigs are harvested for the bark in the spring[238]. An infusion of the leaves is used to reduce inflammations, treat piles, internal haemorrhages and eye inflammations[213]. The leaves are harvested in the summer and can be dried for later use[238]. A homeopathic remedy is made from fresh bark[232]. It is used in the treatment of nosebleeds, piles and varicose veins[232]. Pueraria montana[^3] The kudzu vine, known as Ge Gen in China, is commonly used in Chinese herbalism, where it is considered to be one of the 50 fundamental herbs[218 ]. Recent research has shown that compounds called 'daidzin' and 'daidzein', which are contained in the roots and the flowers, are a safe and effective method for treating alcohol abuse[238 ]. They work by suppressing the appetite for alcohol, whereas existing treatments interfere with the way the alcohol is metabolised and can cause a build-up of toxins[238 ]. The plant is often used in combination with Chrysanthemum x morifolium in treating alcohol abuse[254 ]. The flowers and the roots are antidote, antiemetic, antipyretic, antispasmodic, demulcent, diaphoretic, digestive, febrifuge, hypoglycaemic and hypotensive[174 , 176 , 218 , 222 , 238 ]. A concoction of the flowers and tubers is used to treat alcoholism, fever, colds, diarrhoea, dysentery, acute intestinal obstruction etc[174 , 176 , 218 , 222 ]. It is useful in the treatment of angina pectoris and migraine[218 ]. The root is frequently used as a remedy for measles, often in combination with Cimicifuga foetida[254 ]. The root contains puerarin. This increases the blood flow to the coronary artery and protects against acute myocardial ischaemia caused by the injection of pituitrin[176 ]. The root can be harvested from the autumn to the spring and is used fresh or dried[238 ]. The flowers are harvested just before they are fully open and are dried for later use[238 ]. The stems are galactagogue and are also applied as a poultice to incipient boils, swellings, sore mouths etc[218 , 222 ]. The seed is used in the treatment of hangover and dysentery[218 , 222 ]. The leaves are styptic[218 ]. Ethnobotany is still the main source of new drug discoveries. Culturally medicinal plants like these are easy to identify and then it's just a matter of isolating the active ingredients and investigating ways to manufacture it or increase its effects. We often think of drugs as being single dimensional or serving a single use-case but I think this is mostly a product of how the modern scientific and legal process works and how much work it takes to approve a drug for a particular use-case. [^0]: https://pfaf.org/user/Plant.aspx?LatinName=Ammi+visnaga https://pfaf.org/user/Plant.aspx?LatinName=Ammi+visnaga [^1]: https://pfaf.org/user/Plant.aspx?LatinName=Cinchona+pubescens https://pfaf.org/user/Plant.aspx?LatinName=Cinchona+pubescen... [^2]: https://pfaf.org/user/Plant.aspx?LatinName=Hamamelis+virginiana https://pfaf.org/user/Plant.aspx?LatinName=Hamamelis+virgini... [^3]: https://pfaf.org/user/Plant.aspx?LatinName=Pueraria+montana https://pfaf.org/user/Plant.aspx?LatinName=Pueraria+montana
• trillic 4y ago
  Henbane contains Scopolamine which is, in my opinion, the best drug available for long term motion sickness prevention. Makes sense the Norse had it on a ship. You can get patches of it today, one on the neck lasts 3 days, transforms a person who gets seasick easily to one with the stomach of a seasoned sailor. Never used the stuff myself but have had to get it prescribed for buddies who couldn’t keep their dinner (or water) down after dark.
  • TJSomething 4y ago
    Scopalamine is amazing. Being on the ocean is otherwise a debilitating ordeal for me. Worked really well on cruises I've been on.
    • trillic 4y ago
      The doses are perfect too apparently. Put on 2 patches and you'll hallucinate pirate ships on the horizon, one patch and you're immune to seasickness with just a bit of dry mouth.
• kerpotgh 4y ago
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