4 ms·

Suicide rates are the same before and after transitioning. There's something else going on that needs to be addressed, and simply screaming at and attempting to

Suicide rates are the same before and after transitioning. There's something else going on that needs to be addressed, and simply screaming at and attempting to gaslight critical voices is going to end with the unnecessary deaths of a lot more people.

StanislavPetrov 4y ago
Seems likely from the evidence that gender dysphoria is a good indicator for the existence of an underlying mental condition rather than some sort of glorious lifestyle choice, whether or not the person with dysphoria actually "transitions". Unfortunately instead of helping these troubled people we are placating them and encouraging them to damage themselves (which, to be clear, should be there right if they are adults).
lern_too_spel 4y ago
Are they? Where's the study? I couldn't find one on suicide rates, but this one on based on survey data (so people who are still alive to answer the survey), says that suicidal thoughts reduce after transitioning. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamasurgery/article-abstract/2779429 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamasurgery/article-abstrac...
- 0xy 4y ago
  The study you are citing appears to have been commissioned by the National Center for Transgender Equality (an organization that was founded by a transgender activist). That's like citing a study commissioned by Exxon-Mobil on climate change. Forgive me for being extremely suspicious, given the multitude of other research to the contrary. "The overall mortality for sex-reassigned persons was higher during follow-up" https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043071/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043071/
  - lern_too_spel 4y ago
    > The study you are citing appears to have been commissioned by the National Center for Transgender Equality Wrong. It was funded by a grant from the Patient Centered Outcomes Research Institute, which has no affiliation with any transgender activists. https://www.pcori.org/about/about-pcori https://www.pcori.org/about/about-pcori Forgive me for being extremely suspicious of your ability to evaluate evidence to come to rational conclusions. Your study compares sex-reassigned people to the general population, not those who had surgery against those who wanted surgery but didn't get it. It is cited multiple times with a correct interpretation by the paper I gave you. The author herself points out you're using it wrong. https://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/6q3e8v/science_ama_series_im_cecilia_dhejne_a_fellow_of/ https://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/6q3e8v/science_ama...
    - 0xy 4y ago
      It's analysing the 2015 Transgender Study, which is an online study that was spammed in transgender online communities and was commissioned by the National Center for Transgender Equality, an activist organization. >Forgive me for being extremely suspicious of your ability to evaluate evidence to come to rational conclusions Did you read your own link? It cites the NCTE study clearly.
      - lern_too_spel 4y ago
        > Did you read your own link? It cites the NCTE study clearly. Yes, I did. The study wasn't commissioned by the NCTE, unlike what you claimed. It uses data from a survey by the NCTE. The people answering the survey have no reason to lie, and the NCTE had no reason to believe that its data would be used in this study years later. You're grasping at straws trying to make your initial claim make sense.
        0xy 4y ago
        So the study's data was provided by an activist organization with every reason to have their finger on the scale? Not to mention the numerous study issues that have been uncovered with this particular online survey including but not limited to: no protection against multiple entries, no protection against non-US entries, errors in the survey flow (multiple commenters remarked that the survey questioned them on conditions they said 'no' to -- indicating faulty survey design). Would you trust a survey on sugar done by Coca-Cola? This is the same thing. Activist surveys are worthless. Conflict of interest doesn't even begin to describe it.

StanislavPetrov 4y ago

Seems likely from the evidence that gender dysphoria is a good indicator for the existence of an underlying mental condition rather than some sort of glorious lifestyle choice, whether or not the person with dysphoria actually "transitions". Unfortunately instead of helping these troubled people we are placating them and encouraging them to damage themselves (which, to be clear, should be there right if they are adults).

lern_too_spel 4y ago

Are they? Where's the study? I couldn't find one on suicide rates, but this one on based on survey data (so people who are still alive to answer the survey), says that suicidal thoughts reduce after transitioning. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamasurgery/article-abstract/2779429 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamasurgery/article-abstrac...

0xy 4y ago
The study you are citing appears to have been commissioned by the National Center for Transgender Equality (an organization that was founded by a transgender activist). That's like citing a study commissioned by Exxon-Mobil on climate change. Forgive me for being extremely suspicious, given the multitude of other research to the contrary. "The overall mortality for sex-reassigned persons was higher during follow-up" https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043071/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043071/
- lern_too_spel 4y ago
  > The study you are citing appears to have been commissioned by the National Center for Transgender Equality Wrong. It was funded by a grant from the Patient Centered Outcomes Research Institute, which has no affiliation with any transgender activists. https://www.pcori.org/about/about-pcori https://www.pcori.org/about/about-pcori Forgive me for being extremely suspicious of your ability to evaluate evidence to come to rational conclusions. Your study compares sex-reassigned people to the general population, not those who had surgery against those who wanted surgery but didn't get it. It is cited multiple times with a correct interpretation by the paper I gave you. The author herself points out you're using it wrong. https://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/6q3e8v/science_ama_series_im_cecilia_dhejne_a_fellow_of/ https://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/6q3e8v/science_ama...
  - 0xy 4y ago
    It's analysing the 2015 Transgender Study, which is an online study that was spammed in transgender online communities and was commissioned by the National Center for Transgender Equality, an activist organization. >Forgive me for being extremely suspicious of your ability to evaluate evidence to come to rational conclusions Did you read your own link? It cites the NCTE study clearly.
    - lern_too_spel 4y ago
      > Did you read your own link? It cites the NCTE study clearly. Yes, I did. The study wasn't commissioned by the NCTE, unlike what you claimed. It uses data from a survey by the NCTE. The people answering the survey have no reason to lie, and the NCTE had no reason to believe that its data would be used in this study years later. You're grasping at straws trying to make your initial claim make sense.
      - 0xy 4y ago
        So the study's data was provided by an activist organization with every reason to have their finger on the scale? Not to mention the numerous study issues that have been uncovered with this particular online survey including but not limited to: no protection against multiple entries, no protection against non-US entries, errors in the survey flow (multiple commenters remarked that the survey questioned them on conditions they said 'no' to -- indicating faulty survey design). Would you trust a survey on sugar done by Coca-Cola? This is the same thing. Activist surveys are worthless. Conflict of interest doesn't even begin to describe it.