3 ms·

> The black students said they were harmed. They had learned, in one of their workshops, that objective facts are a tool of white supremacy. What is the end go

> The black students said they were harmed. They had learned, in one of their workshops, that objective facts are a tool of white supremacy. What is the end goal of a lunacy like this? Who is served by convincing people that objective fact does not exist?

mrkeen 4y ago
> objective fact does not exist That was not the claim. The claim was "objective facts are a tool of white supremacy". It sounds like manufactured outrage to me. Even if it's not, it's an unattributed quote at least 3 jumps from its origin. If it can turn from "objective facts are a tool" to "objective fact does not exist" in one jump, who knows what the original workshop presenter intended.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- hpen 4y ago
  Though OP may have not correctly represented the quote, it's still a bullshit statement. "Breathing is a tool of white supremacy" true but meaningless
nucleogenesis 4y ago
I think the students in this particular instance were repeating something they heard without any of the context or reasoning behind it. It’s not that objective facts are always the tool of white supremacy - but rather that facts on their own can be used to reinforce white supremacist culture. Right-wing media folks can point to a fact about black people being convicted of violent crimes at a higher rate than others in a way that carries the implication (or sometimes explicit point) that the black people or their culture must be the cause. The idea is that this is a gross oversimplification and eschews many important factors about US history a la slavery, Jim Crow, redlining, etc that have disproportionally affected black communities which has caused generational poverty. So just saying some fact uncritically is often a tool used by white supremacists (and others in countless contexts). I’m mostly just responding because this lunacy isn’t what people who have studied and wrote about this extensively (such as the author) espouse - or at least it’s a massive oversimplification
- kneebonian 4y ago
  Motte meet bailey
- motogpjimbo 4y ago
  Are you aware that black people commit crimes at higher rates in countries that have no history of slavery or the various other social problems that have existed in the US?
  - fakedang 4y ago
    While I'm usually a strong supporter of objective facts, I would want to call into question this particular statistic though - is it possible that the number for black people is higher because they are discriminated against often by law enforcement a lot more than lighter-skinned folks? I'm a dark skinned non-African person, and I've been pulled over for my stuff and questioned by law enforcement in multiple non-US cities at multiple times of my life. In fact, even in my home country India, I'm often treated with more disdain than my lighter-skinned relatives by law enforcement and what not.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- raxxorraxor 4y ago
  > white supremacist culture. Which is what exactly? To me this sounds made up. You point to racist policies. These can very well have a racist motivation behind them, some certainly do. But they aren't from a culture, there are specific racist actors behind them. I believe the strategy to be afraid of "tools" white supremacists might happen to use is infantile. Real and convinced white supremacists are rare, so far so good. If every action you take is informed by fear, it won't lead to solid decisions.
Overtonwindow 4y ago
Power is the end goal. A student says they were harmed, uses moral outrage to force a change, thereby reinforcing the behavior. Cancel culture and BLM are about exerting power and making others do something they don't want to do.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]

mrkeen 4y ago

> objective fact does not exist That was not the claim. The claim was "objective facts are a tool of white supremacy". It sounds like manufactured outrage to me. Even if it's not, it's an unattributed quote at least 3 jumps from its origin. If it can turn from "objective facts are a tool" to "objective fact does not exist" in one jump, who knows what the original workshop presenter intended.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
hpen 4y ago
Though OP may have not correctly represented the quote, it's still a bullshit statement. "Breathing is a tool of white supremacy" true but meaningless

nucleogenesis 4y ago

I think the students in this particular instance were repeating something they heard without any of the context or reasoning behind it. It’s not that objective facts are always the tool of white supremacy - but rather that facts on their own can be used to reinforce white supremacist culture. Right-wing media folks can point to a fact about black people being convicted of violent crimes at a higher rate than others in a way that carries the implication (or sometimes explicit point) that the black people or their culture must be the cause. The idea is that this is a gross oversimplification and eschews many important factors about US history a la slavery, Jim Crow, redlining, etc that have disproportionally affected black communities which has caused generational poverty. So just saying some fact uncritically is often a tool used by white supremacists (and others in countless contexts). I’m mostly just responding because this lunacy isn’t what people who have studied and wrote about this extensively (such as the author) espouse - or at least it’s a massive oversimplification

kneebonian 4y ago
Motte meet bailey
motogpjimbo 4y ago
Are you aware that black people commit crimes at higher rates in countries that have no history of slavery or the various other social problems that have existed in the US?
- fakedang 4y ago
  While I'm usually a strong supporter of objective facts, I would want to call into question this particular statistic though - is it possible that the number for black people is higher because they are discriminated against often by law enforcement a lot more than lighter-skinned folks? I'm a dark skinned non-African person, and I've been pulled over for my stuff and questioned by law enforcement in multiple non-US cities at multiple times of my life. In fact, even in my home country India, I'm often treated with more disdain than my lighter-skinned relatives by law enforcement and what not.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
raxxorraxor 4y ago
> white supremacist culture. Which is what exactly? To me this sounds made up. You point to racist policies. These can very well have a racist motivation behind them, some certainly do. But they aren't from a culture, there are specific racist actors behind them. I believe the strategy to be afraid of "tools" white supremacists might happen to use is infantile. Real and convinced white supremacists are rare, so far so good. If every action you take is informed by fear, it won't lead to solid decisions.

Overtonwindow 4y ago

Power is the end goal. A student says they were harmed, uses moral outrage to force a change, thereby reinforcing the behavior. Cancel culture and BLM are about exerting power and making others do something they don't want to do.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]