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None of that debunks the reasonable assumption that a random individual from any previous century, particularly those before there were widely available means

None of that debunks the reasonable assumption that a random individual from any previous century, particularly those before there were widely available means of travel other than walking and perhaps horseback, would have moved around a lot less in their lifetime than one from today. Further, I just recently watched a video of essentially an animated map showing the spread of humanity and human civilization across the globe compressed into 19 minutes, and even if you only consider "history" as beginning around 2000 BC it really did take an awful long time for trading populations to spread out from the near east+Egypt region to the rest of the world, first gradually taking in most of modern day Europe and then with a massive acceleration starting sometime around the 1600s that led to our modern idea of a world where almost no matter where you're born, you have a reasonable chance of being able to travel to another country, and of course for those of us in the developed world, a decent chance of travelling around the globe multiple times within a single lifetime. Even just 100 years ago that privilege would have been restricted to the very few.

TedDoesntTalk 4y ago
> those of us in the developed world, a decent chance of travelling around the globe multiple times within a single lifetime. Even just 100 years ago that privilege would have been restricted to the very few I think you’re forgetting how expensive international airfare was even in the 1980s. Traveling around the world multiple times in the 1960s, 70s, and 80s would have been very expensive compared to today (note: I’m considering airfare only, not accommodations)
- wizofaus 4y ago
  Our family was basically middle class growing up but we traveled to Europe (from Australia) twice within a few years, both times in the 80s. But sure, you don't have to go a full 100 years back for that sort of luxury to be a rare thing even in wealthy countries - still, there were quite a few that made one-time journeys across half the globe at least, and many of us today have parents and even multiple grandparents that did just that of course.
  - HWR_14 4y ago
    > Our family was basically middle class Most people tend to think of themselves as "middle-class". Your family may have been. Or maybe that's what you grew up with and was normal in your community but not "middle-class". That point aside, the 1980's was the beginning of cheaper travel. In the 1950's it was the modern equivalent of $45,000 (all 'modern' prices are pre-COVID inflation adjusted Perth-to-London). It decreased by by 82% by 1980. It pretty much leveled out in the mid-1980's to today, inflation adjusted. Although the same rates your parents paid probably would have gotten them business class tickets now.
- cheese_van 4y ago
  Remember though, these spices were not carried by, say one trader, from origin to destination. The trade occurred along known routes that were relatively fixed, so trading communities grew. It was there that you got the goods - not at the origin. So you can say the spices traveled, but the fixed traders didn't have to. Cloves have been found at Syrian 4th millennium B.C. sites, Tel Mozan I think, indicating an unbroken route to Indonesia. Our ancestors were not unsophisticated.
- inglor_cz 4y ago
  When I was a student and wanted to visit a cryptographic workshop in 2004, I traveled Prague to Barcelona and back for, then, some 700 eur. That was by far the cheapest option, bought months in advance. Looking at the options now, 200 eur is very doable, although there will be extra fees for luggage. But there have been almost 20 years in between! In 2004, 700 eur must have been around the average net monthly salary in CZ; now, the average net salary is almost twice as high. So, from a purchasing power point of view, costs of flying have gone down about 7x for a Czech person, in mere 19 years.
vongomben 4y ago
Can you share the link to the video? I m curious now!

TedDoesntTalk 4y ago

> those of us in the developed world, a decent chance of travelling around the globe multiple times within a single lifetime. Even just 100 years ago that privilege would have been restricted to the very few I think you’re forgetting how expensive international airfare was even in the 1980s. Traveling around the world multiple times in the 1960s, 70s, and 80s would have been very expensive compared to today (note: I’m considering airfare only, not accommodations)

wizofaus 4y ago
Our family was basically middle class growing up but we traveled to Europe (from Australia) twice within a few years, both times in the 80s. But sure, you don't have to go a full 100 years back for that sort of luxury to be a rare thing even in wealthy countries - still, there were quite a few that made one-time journeys across half the globe at least, and many of us today have parents and even multiple grandparents that did just that of course.
- HWR_14 4y ago
  > Our family was basically middle class Most people tend to think of themselves as "middle-class". Your family may have been. Or maybe that's what you grew up with and was normal in your community but not "middle-class". That point aside, the 1980's was the beginning of cheaper travel. In the 1950's it was the modern equivalent of $45,000 (all 'modern' prices are pre-COVID inflation adjusted Perth-to-London). It decreased by by 82% by 1980. It pretty much leveled out in the mid-1980's to today, inflation adjusted. Although the same rates your parents paid probably would have gotten them business class tickets now.
cheese_van 4y ago
Remember though, these spices were not carried by, say one trader, from origin to destination. The trade occurred along known routes that were relatively fixed, so trading communities grew. It was there that you got the goods - not at the origin. So you can say the spices traveled, but the fixed traders didn't have to. Cloves have been found at Syrian 4th millennium B.C. sites, Tel Mozan I think, indicating an unbroken route to Indonesia. Our ancestors were not unsophisticated.
inglor_cz 4y ago
When I was a student and wanted to visit a cryptographic workshop in 2004, I traveled Prague to Barcelona and back for, then, some 700 eur. That was by far the cheapest option, bought months in advance. Looking at the options now, 200 eur is very doable, although there will be extra fees for luggage. But there have been almost 20 years in between! In 2004, 700 eur must have been around the average net monthly salary in CZ; now, the average net salary is almost twice as high. So, from a purchasing power point of view, costs of flying have gone down about 7x for a Czech person, in mere 19 years.

vongomben 4y ago

Can you share the link to the video? I m curious now!