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https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/1/30/erdogan-says-turkey-may-accept-finland-in-nato-but-not-sweden https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/1/30/erdogan-says-tur

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/1/30/erdogan-says-turkey-may-accept-finland-in-nato-but-not-sweden https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/1/30/erdogan-says-turkey... This is non-news. Turkey is holding up Sweden and Finland for nonsense reasons. Probably some kind of behind the scenes politics going on. Finland saying they ‘think’ it will happen means nothing.

webmobdev 4y ago
The real "nonsense" is their claim that they want to join the NATO. It's just posturing and they do not want to join NATO and give up their "neutrality". If Sweden was serious about it, the Swedish government wouldn't have allowed the Quran burning incident to happen knowing it would cause genuine outrage among the Turkish (who have a large population of muslims). Finland is also trying to weasel itself out by saying that it will join NATO only if Sweden joins it.
- NicoJuicy 4y ago
  You heard about the Quran incident, but aren't aware of the Russians behind it?
  - NicoJuicy 4y ago
    Or that Finland discussed joining NATO without Sweden? https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/finland-discuss-nato-ratification-that-may-leave-sweden-behind-2023-02-10/ https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/finland-discuss-nato-ra... I mean, you're seems unknowing ( and that's very lightly put). Since Finland and Sweden very clearly applied NATO membership together and now Finland actually wants to join NATO without Sweden because of Turkey. You're timeline of things is way off. What are the news sources you're following for this opinion? I'm really curious.
    - webmobdev 4y ago
      Or rather, you only read western propaganda, while I read both western, Russian & Chinese propaganda too to get the whole picture. Finland is considering joining NATO without Sweden. Their political process is yet to put forward a concrete decision on this matter. The Finnish Prime Minister is pushing the idea of Finland joining NATO without Sweden as they have a Parliamentary election in April this year. Obviously the opposition wouldn't like the government to benefit from that so they aren't sure if they should support this. There are some reasonable objections to this idea from other Finnish politicians (who consider the matter on the merit of the subject than from opportunistic politics) because without Sweden in NATO, Finland will have to spend more for the defence of the Baltics. Militarily too, in case NATO needs to, Finland cannot effectively block the Gulf of Finland if the Swedes are not on board (and if they are not in NATO, and remain "neutral", they are highly unlikely to participate in any such military endeavour). As for the "Russians behind the Quran burning in Sweden" idea, that may be true. And yet that doesn't in any way matter to what I pointed out - the Swedes were very well aware that the Quran burning had been planned, and yet they didn't do anything to prevent it. Which means they allowed it with a deliberate intention to sabotage the process - either because they were pressured by the EU to announce they would join NATO to rattle Russia or they do not want to join NATO or because they aren't willing to accept the conditions imposed on them by Turkey (who wants them to end support for "terrorists" and hand many of them over to Turkey). (This is a conclusion purely drawn by me - Unlike Finland, which has around 75% support now for joining NATO, only 60% of Swedens are in favour of joining NATO. So perhaps Swedish politicians think they can handle the backlash if Sweden is unable to join NATO. Especially if they can use Islamophobia and blame Turkey.) We'll know for sure about Finland only between April to July of this year.
      - NicoJuicy 4y ago
        I think "western propaganda" would be more similar to the Finnish one ;). "Western propaganda" as you call it, isn't state sponsored as it is in Russia or China. Just stating the obvious here. As for the Quran, while it's weird to do it. It isn't illegal, as they mentioned it falls under freedom of speech. That doesn't mean that some actors are not taking advantage of that, in this case => Russia.
  - webmobdev 4y ago
    Doesn't matter if "the Russians are behind it" - the Swedish government still allowed the Quran burning. Let me repeat that - the Swedish government was well aware about this "protest" and still allowed it to happen knowing very well how Turkey would react to it. Do you really believe allowing some religious book to be burnt was more important for them than joining NATO (which apparently they need to because of national security)!? The only conclusion that can be drawn is that the Swedes aren't serious about joining NATO, yet.
    - NicoJuicy 4y ago
      Starting a new threat? Why? Sure it matters. Russia is trying to add pressure and abiding democracy. It's always important in a democracy who is doing what and what their viewpoints are. In this case, it didn't deserve any attention. Erdogan is just a PITA as usual too. He even tried in court against comedy in Belgium.
      - webmobdev 4y ago
        If the Swedes were serious about joining NATO, they could have pressured the protestor to do his Quran burning after Sweden had become a member. But instead, they allowed it to happen even though they knew how Turkey would react. And this isn't an "Erdogan" issue. There is genuine outrage among the Turkish population about this incident and it will be very hard for any Turkish politician to overcome the public animosity against Sweden. That means Turkey will not support Sweden becoming a NATO member.
        NicoJuicy 4y ago
        What? Do you realize that you statement is delusional? And that the person doing the burning of the Quran is not affliated to the government of Sweden, but to Russia. Which i already mentioned above...

webmobdev 4y ago

The real "nonsense" is their claim that they want to join the NATO. It's just posturing and they do not want to join NATO and give up their "neutrality". If Sweden was serious about it, the Swedish government wouldn't have allowed the Quran burning incident to happen knowing it would cause genuine outrage among the Turkish (who have a large population of muslims). Finland is also trying to weasel itself out by saying that it will join NATO only if Sweden joins it.

NicoJuicy 4y ago
You heard about the Quran incident, but aren't aware of the Russians behind it?
- NicoJuicy 4y ago
  Or that Finland discussed joining NATO without Sweden? https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/finland-discuss-nato-ratification-that-may-leave-sweden-behind-2023-02-10/ https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/finland-discuss-nato-ra... I mean, you're seems unknowing ( and that's very lightly put). Since Finland and Sweden very clearly applied NATO membership together and now Finland actually wants to join NATO without Sweden because of Turkey. You're timeline of things is way off. What are the news sources you're following for this opinion? I'm really curious.
  - webmobdev 4y ago
    Or rather, you only read western propaganda, while I read both western, Russian & Chinese propaganda too to get the whole picture. Finland is considering joining NATO without Sweden. Their political process is yet to put forward a concrete decision on this matter. The Finnish Prime Minister is pushing the idea of Finland joining NATO without Sweden as they have a Parliamentary election in April this year. Obviously the opposition wouldn't like the government to benefit from that so they aren't sure if they should support this. There are some reasonable objections to this idea from other Finnish politicians (who consider the matter on the merit of the subject than from opportunistic politics) because without Sweden in NATO, Finland will have to spend more for the defence of the Baltics. Militarily too, in case NATO needs to, Finland cannot effectively block the Gulf of Finland if the Swedes are not on board (and if they are not in NATO, and remain "neutral", they are highly unlikely to participate in any such military endeavour). As for the "Russians behind the Quran burning in Sweden" idea, that may be true. And yet that doesn't in any way matter to what I pointed out - the Swedes were very well aware that the Quran burning had been planned, and yet they didn't do anything to prevent it. Which means they allowed it with a deliberate intention to sabotage the process - either because they were pressured by the EU to announce they would join NATO to rattle Russia or they do not want to join NATO or because they aren't willing to accept the conditions imposed on them by Turkey (who wants them to end support for "terrorists" and hand many of them over to Turkey). (This is a conclusion purely drawn by me - Unlike Finland, which has around 75% support now for joining NATO, only 60% of Swedens are in favour of joining NATO. So perhaps Swedish politicians think they can handle the backlash if Sweden is unable to join NATO. Especially if they can use Islamophobia and blame Turkey.) We'll know for sure about Finland only between April to July of this year.
    - NicoJuicy 4y ago
      I think "western propaganda" would be more similar to the Finnish one ;). "Western propaganda" as you call it, isn't state sponsored as it is in Russia or China. Just stating the obvious here. As for the Quran, while it's weird to do it. It isn't illegal, as they mentioned it falls under freedom of speech. That doesn't mean that some actors are not taking advantage of that, in this case => Russia.
- webmobdev 4y ago
  Doesn't matter if "the Russians are behind it" - the Swedish government still allowed the Quran burning. Let me repeat that - the Swedish government was well aware about this "protest" and still allowed it to happen knowing very well how Turkey would react to it. Do you really believe allowing some religious book to be burnt was more important for them than joining NATO (which apparently they need to because of national security)!? The only conclusion that can be drawn is that the Swedes aren't serious about joining NATO, yet.
  - NicoJuicy 4y ago
    Starting a new threat? Why? Sure it matters. Russia is trying to add pressure and abiding democracy. It's always important in a democracy who is doing what and what their viewpoints are. In this case, it didn't deserve any attention. Erdogan is just a PITA as usual too. He even tried in court against comedy in Belgium.
    - webmobdev 4y ago
      If the Swedes were serious about joining NATO, they could have pressured the protestor to do his Quran burning after Sweden had become a member. But instead, they allowed it to happen even though they knew how Turkey would react. And this isn't an "Erdogan" issue. There is genuine outrage among the Turkish population about this incident and it will be very hard for any Turkish politician to overcome the public animosity against Sweden. That means Turkey will not support Sweden becoming a NATO member.
      - NicoJuicy 4y ago
        What? Do you realize that you statement is delusional? And that the person doing the burning of the Quran is not affliated to the government of Sweden, but to Russia. Which i already mentioned above...