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Oh, yes please. Having a custom connector when the world has standardized around USB-C is super user hostile. Even their own product lineup is confused: Mac:

Oh, yes please. Having a custom connector when the world has standardized around USB-C is super user hostile. Even their own product lineup is confused: Mac: USB-C iPad: USB-C iPhone: lightning AirPods: lightning

650REDHAIR 4y ago
I recently watched an iPhone 13 conversion video where someone essentially tucked in the lightning to C chip from the stock Apple charging cable inside of the phone and used a Samsung type C port to maintain the waterproof rating. It was pretty neat and eye opening. I’m considering the project when I retire my current phone so I can continue to use the old phone as a video camera in my rig where everything else is type C. https://youtu.be/1yudWXta6dM https://youtu.be/1yudWXta6dM
cokeandpepsi 4y ago
[dead]
Nursie 4y ago
Fingers crossed the iPhone 15 will ship with usb-c, at least in Europe. I’m hoping everywhere but maybe I can grab a euro model if not. That said, my 12 pro is still going strong and I’m not feeling any particular desire to upgrade yet.
- bombcar 4y ago
  They should ship the 15 with USB c on one end and lightning in the other.
midoridensha 4y ago
The easiest solution is to simply not buy Apple equipment since they're user-hostile. Apple is a premium luxury brand, like Bentley or Coach or Rolex. If you buy Apple stuff, you should be happy to buy different chargers and cables for the different Apple devices.
- coldpie 4y ago
  Apple is the only (the one, the only) phone manufacturer that sells a human-hand-sized phone in the US, the iPhone Mini. I'd love to go back to Android, I find iOS to be pretty terrible, but I'm afraid my hands are not 15 inches wide, so it's just not an option for me.
- philliphaydon 4y ago
  > The easiest solution is to simply not buy Apple equipment since they're user-hostile. Why do people spread this false doctrine?
  - dmonitor 4y ago
    Right? "Don't buy user-hostile Apple equipment. Use Windows instead!" What world are these people even from?
  - ggm 4y ago
    because the word "simplest" has so many locally contextually defined meanings that communication is fraught. I mean "honour your father and mother" -what does the word honour mean?? bestow them with a title? give them a gold Oscar statue? Also you said spread. I didn't see a jar of butter and a knife. what spread is this? You said doctrine. Can I see some statements from the episcopacy on this please...
  - __MatrixMan__ 4y ago
    Not doing something is generally easier than doing something...
- threeseed 4y ago
  I always love the delusional argument that Apple is a premium brand like Rolex. Rolex sells watches that are incredible pieces of engineering but functionally can be found in a watch that is 10000x cheaper. There is no laptop that I can buy today that is equivalent to an M2 MacBook Pro at any price point let alone significantly cheaper.
  - 4y ago
leidenfrost 4y ago
It made sense before USB-C. Now it's made to inconvenience the previous iphone users so they are given one more reason not to buy an android phone.
- katbyte 4y ago
  Nah I think it’s because apple didn’t want to be the “evil company forcing them to buy new cables and devices” and getting backlash like when the introduced lightning in the first place. This way they waited it out and now the eu “is to blame”
JimDabell 4y ago
AirPods do have a standard way of charging. You can put them on any Qi charger to charge them. No custom connector needed.
- layer8 4y ago
  The cheaper AirPod cases don’t support wireless charging.
firecall 4y ago
New Apple TV Remote: USB-C I guess Apple are getting there...
imoverclocked 4y ago
Lightning was what Apple standardized on when the world was still using dock connectors with completely incompatible pinouts and wire protocols. The fact that Apple pushed a usb compatible wire protocol (instead of, say, firewire?) in the first place is the opposite of user-hostile. If Apple had changed its connector in any way in the last decade, people would have similarly complained that they are changing in order to sell more chargers and cables. Neither one of these arguments is very compelling to me but seems to keep coming up.
- BuyMyBitcoins 4y ago
  The iPod was originally designed to be connected via FireWire only. It took an incredible amount of internal pressure to get Steve Jobs to relent and allow USB.
  - ascagnel_ 4y ago
    The iPod only went USB once USB 2.0 was widely deployed (the spec was ratified in 2001, the first USB iPod was 2003). USB 1.0/1.1 (1.5/12Mbps) were not fast enough for the 5GB-20GB drives of the day, especially compared to the prevailing FireWire standard (400Mbps).
- ihusasmiiu 4y ago
  > Lightning was what Apple standardized on when the world was still using dock connectors with completely incompatible pinouts and wire protocols. What? Lighting is what Apple imposed (to themselves) when the world standardized on micro USB and Apple was still using dock connectors.
  - karlshea 4y ago
    But the micro USB connector is trash, so it’s no surprise they didn’t use it.
    - ginko 4y ago
      So they should have been active in defining the successor USB standard.
crooked-v 4y ago
I suspect the goal is to remove physical ports entirely from any device small enough to practically charge wirelessly, so they're just delaying until they can do that to replace Lightning.
scarface74 4y ago
Yes because USB C is so user friendly: Grab a random USB C cable, now answer a few questions - how much power can it deliver? - how much data can it deliver? - can it deliver video over USB?
- zeroonetwothree 4y ago
  Somehow I don’t think any of these are an issue for AirPods
  - scarface74 4y ago
    What’s the use of a “universal cable” that doesn’t work everywhere even though it should?
    - BuyMyBitcoins 4y ago
      The way I had it explained to me is that “Type C” is the form factor, and that’s what is meant by universal. Which actual USB standard is implemented by the client/host varies widely. This leads to an immense amount of confusion because people are used to different form factors indicating compatibility.
      - cesarb 4y ago
        > The way I had it explained to me is that “Type C” is the form factor, and that’s what is meant by universal. Which actual USB standard is implemented by the client/host varies widely. There's also a couple of universal USB standards: every client/host is supposed to implement USB 2.0, unless they're charging-only; and every client/host is supposed to implement simple power delivery (negotiated through resistor values) at 5V and at least 500mA (for a USB-A 2.0 to USB-C cable, other combinations are supposed to deliver more current).
      - dotancohen 4y ago
        And the corollary is: What is the advantage of a universal form factor if the wire protocols are different? If the wire protocols are different, then an identical form factor is a hindrance, not an advantage.
katbyte 4y ago
iPhones have an ecosystem around lighting, cables docks devices etc, to change that would cause users to be far more upset then having a different cable then other devices, see the outrage when they switched to lightning in the first place There isn’t as much an ecosystem of lightning devices for macs as it was usb a. I assume iPads also had less. Dunno about AirPods thou I assume they saw the writing on the wall and figured they would wait till the eu forced usb c so users will Blame them Not apple for the switch
- emsixteen 4y ago
  > iPhones have an ecosystem around lighting, cables docks devices etc, to change that would cause users to be far more upset then having a different cable then other devices, see the outrage when they switched to lightning in the first place Actually incredible to me that people can have this mindset. Have an adapter for your gaff proprietary cable with MFI chips to make sure third parties can't make long-lasting ones cheaply, not for the standardised USB-C one.
- JimDabell 4y ago
  > see the outrage when they switched to lightning in the first place Yeah, Apple have changed their preferred physical connector for phones and peripherals once in the last 16 years, from the 30 pin connector to Lightning. When they did that, there was outrage that they were obsoleting all the devices that used the 30 pin connector because of “planned obsolescence”. Meanwhile, Android phones have gone from ExtUSB to mini-USB, to micro-USB, to USB-C in the same timeframe with all the accompanying adapter / cable / accessory churn. If Apple had changed to USB-C while Android vendors were still mostly using micro-USB, there would have been a repeat of the outrage about “planned obsolescence” again as evil Apple forced people to switch from using Lightning to USB-C.
  - dmitriid 4y ago
    No idea why you're being downvoted when it's true.
  - Eisenstein 4y ago
_puk 4y ago
Mac: USB-C Magic Mouse: lightning I have this work provided combo, and the mouse is the only device in the house that takes a lightning connector. Cue frantically trying to find that cable every time it gets low.. USB-C and I could just plug the wall charger into it and be done with it.
- JimDabell 4y ago
  If your mouse is the only device in your house that takes a lightning connector, why are you frantically trying to find the cable every time it gets low? Just keep the cable by your mouse. It’s not like you are using it for anything else. And why “frantically” anyway? The mouse gives you loads of warning before the battery goes, I routinely use it for hours after the warning. This is not an emergency.
  - projektfu 4y ago
    Just
  - Eisenstein 4y ago
    So you wouldn't mind if you keyboard had its own cable as well and gave you plenty of warning before the battery dies? At what point is it ok to complain about an annoying inconvenience that doesn't have to exist?
rimliu 4y ago
It's a bit funny to see "the world has standardised around USB-C" and recall the discussions when Apple first dropped USB-A from their laptops :)
have_faith 4y ago
Keyboards are lightning too; they come with a lightning -> USB-C cable in the box. I imagine all of their lineup will eventually move to it, shame it wasn't in one swoop though.

650REDHAIR 4y ago

I recently watched an iPhone 13 conversion video where someone essentially tucked in the lightning to C chip from the stock Apple charging cable inside of the phone and used a Samsung type C port to maintain the waterproof rating. It was pretty neat and eye opening. I’m considering the project when I retire my current phone so I can continue to use the old phone as a video camera in my rig where everything else is type C. https://youtu.be/1yudWXta6dM https://youtu.be/1yudWXta6dM

cokeandpepsi 4y ago

[dead]

Nursie 4y ago

Fingers crossed the iPhone 15 will ship with usb-c, at least in Europe. I’m hoping everywhere but maybe I can grab a euro model if not. That said, my 12 pro is still going strong and I’m not feeling any particular desire to upgrade yet.

bombcar 4y ago
They should ship the 15 with USB c on one end and lightning in the other.

midoridensha 4y ago

The easiest solution is to simply not buy Apple equipment since they're user-hostile. Apple is a premium luxury brand, like Bentley or Coach or Rolex. If you buy Apple stuff, you should be happy to buy different chargers and cables for the different Apple devices.

coldpie 4y ago
Apple is the only (the one, the only) phone manufacturer that sells a human-hand-sized phone in the US, the iPhone Mini. I'd love to go back to Android, I find iOS to be pretty terrible, but I'm afraid my hands are not 15 inches wide, so it's just not an option for me.
philliphaydon 4y ago
> The easiest solution is to simply not buy Apple equipment since they're user-hostile. Why do people spread this false doctrine?
- dmonitor 4y ago
  Right? "Don't buy user-hostile Apple equipment. Use Windows instead!" What world are these people even from?
- ggm 4y ago
  because the word "simplest" has so many locally contextually defined meanings that communication is fraught. I mean "honour your father and mother" -what does the word honour mean?? bestow them with a title? give them a gold Oscar statue? Also you said spread. I didn't see a jar of butter and a knife. what spread is this? You said doctrine. Can I see some statements from the episcopacy on this please...
- __MatrixMan__ 4y ago
  Not doing something is generally easier than doing something...
threeseed 4y ago
I always love the delusional argument that Apple is a premium brand like Rolex. Rolex sells watches that are incredible pieces of engineering but functionally can be found in a watch that is 10000x cheaper. There is no laptop that I can buy today that is equivalent to an M2 MacBook Pro at any price point let alone significantly cheaper.
- 4y ago

leidenfrost 4y ago

It made sense before USB-C. Now it's made to inconvenience the previous iphone users so they are given one more reason not to buy an android phone.

katbyte 4y ago
Nah I think it’s because apple didn’t want to be the “evil company forcing them to buy new cables and devices” and getting backlash like when the introduced lightning in the first place. This way they waited it out and now the eu “is to blame”

JimDabell 4y ago

AirPods do have a standard way of charging. You can put them on any Qi charger to charge them. No custom connector needed.

layer8 4y ago
The cheaper AirPod cases don’t support wireless charging.

firecall 4y ago

New Apple TV Remote: USB-C I guess Apple are getting there...

imoverclocked 4y ago

Lightning was what Apple standardized on when the world was still using dock connectors with completely incompatible pinouts and wire protocols. The fact that Apple pushed a usb compatible wire protocol (instead of, say, firewire?) in the first place is the opposite of user-hostile. If Apple had changed its connector in any way in the last decade, people would have similarly complained that they are changing in order to sell more chargers and cables. Neither one of these arguments is very compelling to me but seems to keep coming up.

BuyMyBitcoins 4y ago
The iPod was originally designed to be connected via FireWire only. It took an incredible amount of internal pressure to get Steve Jobs to relent and allow USB.
- ascagnel_ 4y ago
  The iPod only went USB once USB 2.0 was widely deployed (the spec was ratified in 2001, the first USB iPod was 2003). USB 1.0/1.1 (1.5/12Mbps) were not fast enough for the 5GB-20GB drives of the day, especially compared to the prevailing FireWire standard (400Mbps).
ihusasmiiu 4y ago
> Lightning was what Apple standardized on when the world was still using dock connectors with completely incompatible pinouts and wire protocols. What? Lighting is what Apple imposed (to themselves) when the world standardized on micro USB and Apple was still using dock connectors.
- karlshea 4y ago
  But the micro USB connector is trash, so it’s no surprise they didn’t use it.
  - ginko 4y ago
    So they should have been active in defining the successor USB standard.

crooked-v 4y ago

I suspect the goal is to remove physical ports entirely from any device small enough to practically charge wirelessly, so they're just delaying until they can do that to replace Lightning.

scarface74 4y ago

Yes because USB C is so user friendly: Grab a random USB C cable, now answer a few questions - how much power can it deliver? - how much data can it deliver? - can it deliver video over USB?

zeroonetwothree 4y ago
Somehow I don’t think any of these are an issue for AirPods
- scarface74 4y ago
  What’s the use of a “universal cable” that doesn’t work everywhere even though it should?
  - BuyMyBitcoins 4y ago
    The way I had it explained to me is that “Type C” is the form factor, and that’s what is meant by universal. Which actual USB standard is implemented by the client/host varies widely. This leads to an immense amount of confusion because people are used to different form factors indicating compatibility.
    - cesarb 4y ago
      > The way I had it explained to me is that “Type C” is the form factor, and that’s what is meant by universal. Which actual USB standard is implemented by the client/host varies widely. There's also a couple of universal USB standards: every client/host is supposed to implement USB 2.0, unless they're charging-only; and every client/host is supposed to implement simple power delivery (negotiated through resistor values) at 5V and at least 500mA (for a USB-A 2.0 to USB-C cable, other combinations are supposed to deliver more current).
    - dotancohen 4y ago
      And the corollary is: What is the advantage of a universal form factor if the wire protocols are different? If the wire protocols are different, then an identical form factor is a hindrance, not an advantage.

katbyte 4y ago

iPhones have an ecosystem around lighting, cables docks devices etc, to change that would cause users to be far more upset then having a different cable then other devices, see the outrage when they switched to lightning in the first place There isn’t as much an ecosystem of lightning devices for macs as it was usb a. I assume iPads also had less. Dunno about AirPods thou I assume they saw the writing on the wall and figured they would wait till the eu forced usb c so users will Blame them Not apple for the switch

emsixteen 4y ago
> iPhones have an ecosystem around lighting, cables docks devices etc, to change that would cause users to be far more upset then having a different cable then other devices, see the outrage when they switched to lightning in the first place Actually incredible to me that people can have this mindset. Have an adapter for your gaff proprietary cable with MFI chips to make sure third parties can't make long-lasting ones cheaply, not for the standardised USB-C one.
JimDabell 4y ago
> see the outrage when they switched to lightning in the first place Yeah, Apple have changed their preferred physical connector for phones and peripherals once in the last 16 years, from the 30 pin connector to Lightning. When they did that, there was outrage that they were obsoleting all the devices that used the 30 pin connector because of “planned obsolescence”. Meanwhile, Android phones have gone from ExtUSB to mini-USB, to micro-USB, to USB-C in the same timeframe with all the accompanying adapter / cable / accessory churn. If Apple had changed to USB-C while Android vendors were still mostly using micro-USB, there would have been a repeat of the outrage about “planned obsolescence” again as evil Apple forced people to switch from using Lightning to USB-C.
- dmitriid 4y ago
  No idea why you're being downvoted when it's true.
- Eisenstein 4y ago

_puk 4y ago

Mac: USB-C Magic Mouse: lightning I have this work provided combo, and the mouse is the only device in the house that takes a lightning connector. Cue frantically trying to find that cable every time it gets low.. USB-C and I could just plug the wall charger into it and be done with it.

JimDabell 4y ago
If your mouse is the only device in your house that takes a lightning connector, why are you frantically trying to find the cable every time it gets low? Just keep the cable by your mouse. It’s not like you are using it for anything else. And why “frantically” anyway? The mouse gives you loads of warning before the battery goes, I routinely use it for hours after the warning. This is not an emergency.
- projektfu 4y ago
  Just
- Eisenstein 4y ago
  So you wouldn't mind if you keyboard had its own cable as well and gave you plenty of warning before the battery dies? At what point is it ok to complain about an annoying inconvenience that doesn't have to exist?

rimliu 4y ago

It's a bit funny to see "the world has standardised around USB-C" and recall the discussions when Apple first dropped USB-A from their laptops :)

have_faith 4y ago

Keyboards are lightning too; they come with a lightning -> USB-C cable in the box. I imagine all of their lineup will eventually move to it, shame it wasn't in one swoop though.