6 ms·

Here's the product datasheet: https://www.dyaqua.it/invisiblesolar/_en/documents/rooftile-invisiblesolar-technical-datasheet.pdf https://www.dyaqua.it/invisible

Here's the product datasheet: https://www.dyaqua.it/invisiblesolar/_en/documents/rooftile-invisiblesolar-technical-datasheet.pdf https://www.dyaqua.it/invisiblesolar/_en/documents/rooftile-... An independent research center lists the efficiency as 0.111: https://integratedpv.eurac.edu/en/products/modules/invisible-solar-rooftile.html https://integratedpv.eurac.edu/en/products/modules/invisible... Anybody know how that compares to an average panel on the market today? From a quick search it seems like the best you can actually buy is 0.22 efficiency. Edit: The best available on this site is 0.216 (https://integratedpv.eurac.edu/en/products/modules/fu-425-m-zebra-pro-all-black.html https://integratedpv.eurac.edu/en/products/modules/fu-425-m-...), but I think they only test Italian-manufactured products. 0.111 is on the low end, but significantly better than a few things like solar glass.

kristopolous 4y ago
That's fine, they look great. Realizing we've got stuff looking like that that generates freakin' electricity is amazing.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- positr0n 4y ago
  Given the poorer efficiency, wouldn't it be better use of limited money and resources to put regular tiles on houses and normal solar panels somewhere else? (Honest question. I've always wondered why residential rooftop solar, especially since it's usually government subsidized, makes sense anywhere in the world.)
  - ilyt 4y ago
    I mean if you own multiple properties, sure... But if it is your house and you don't want to compromise on look, it's a way.
  - killingtime74 4y ago
    Money is being optimized if the land is not free. Solar panels are relatively inexpensive even if inefficient if the land is sufficiently expensive. Electricity cost can vary a lot. If you have a lot of expensive panels and don't have to hook up to the grid that can save a lot of money
  - gamblor956 4y ago
    It's an historical site. The whole point of these tiles is that they visually fit in with the ruins. These are not tiles you would use for general solar production.
  - kristopolous 4y ago
    "I've always wondered why residential rooftop solar, especially since it's usually government subsidized, makes sense anywhere in the world." Transmission isn't free and the surface is already there. Both places are fine.
  - cmarschner 4y ago
    It makes sense to put nicer looking tiles on rooftops if you value the looks of them. You would then find normal looking tiles a tax. That‘s why it could make sense to put solar panels on roofs that don‘t impose this tax on you even if their efficiency is lower.
    - stavros 4y ago
      This answer is to "given that you want solar panels, why put tiles". I think the question is "given that you want tiles, why put solar panels".
  - TheCapeGreek 4y ago
    It's useful for the NIMBYs and historical conservation areas.
    - gameman144 4y ago
      I mean, not wanting commercial solar farms in your back yard seems like one of the more reasonable things to not want in your back yard. Especially when aesthetically pleasing (if less efficient) rooftop solar fits the bill nicely.
  - hgomersall 4y ago
    A properly designed house with solar can be energy neutral over the year in the UK (not notable for its sunny climate).
    - graphe 4y ago
      What does energy neutral mean? What does properly designed mean? And at what cost to comfort or the property? You could turn off all your electricity and heat yourself with kerosene and have used no electricity for the year.
      - pjc50 4y ago
        Usually means "passivehaus", and "energy neutral" would mean "generates an equal quantity of electricity to that consumed, when summed over the year". > heat yourself with kerosene That's not energy neutral, is it now, unless you have a kerosene well on the property.
        graphe 4y ago
        Geothermal energy would be amazing! But it's hard to balance with carbon emissions.
        hgomersall 4y ago
        Precisely - for a smallish 120sqm house the passivhaus heat demand is 1800kWh. 3000kWh is not unreasonable for additional electricity consumption. With a heat pump that heat demand should pessimistically translate into <1000kWh electricity, giving us a total energy usage of ~4000kWh. That's about what a medium size (~20sqm) south-facing roof-mounted PV installation would achieve in the south of the UK.
  - graphe 4y ago
    It's an active volcano, you need to run power lines, the ground shifts, and it can blow any time. It makes sense to make your own power for yourself and you can sell it back to the grid.
  - pjc50 4y ago
    Land tends to be expensive; it would be a real challenge in Europe to find somewhere that isn't being used already for some economic purpose, and also isn't a conservation area and/or physically inacessible or difficult to build on.
  - Cthulhu_ 4y ago
    Why not both? SolarCity (now Tesla) had solar panels that looks like roof tiles. There's a lot of roof space in any town, it makes sense to use that instead of use up land (that could be used for housing or agriculture) for solar power generation. But it can be all of the above, too. More energy produced is not going to go to waste, and there's plenty of unusable areas like deserts where solar electricity can be generated in various ways.
  - emiliobumachar 4y ago
    Adding to the great points already here, decentralized production makes the system more robust to accidents, terrorism, and war. Not immune by any stretch, but more robust.
- marcyb5st 4y ago
  Yeah, but they are also crazy expensive. From their website is 7k Euros for 1kW of installed capacity (not sure if the price includes then installation). I understand beauty factor, but damn. For Pompei it's perfect though
bloodyplonker22 4y ago
I have worked in the solar industry. As a reference, the average efficiency of "normal" solar panels is around 16% today.
- galangalalgol 4y ago
  Does that mean that in high intensity regions you'd need active cooling or is that not a problem?
  - mcronce 4y ago
    This doesn't answer your question, but I really wish someone would offer off-the-shelf panels with tubing on the back to hook up water lines. It would be dope to cool my panels and preheat my hot water at the same time.
    - implements 4y ago
      "Rad" more than "dope" :) I've seen a DIY system where the panels are boxed in, and the hot air created behind the panels used for blown air / heat recovery heating.
    - ilyt 4y ago
      They are usually called "hybrid solar panels" and not exactly a new thing. Usually cheaper to just put more panels tho. Pretty handy if you need to get the most out of roof space but otherwise more panels + heat pump water heater is much simpler solution.
    - bruce511 4y ago
      They exist! For example: https://www.todoensolar.com/epages/61987244.mobile/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/61987244/Products/pvtcrane&Locale=en_GB https://www.todoensolar.com/epages/61987244.mobile/en_GB/?Ob...
    - duckmysick 4y ago
      There's one combining a heat exchanger and photovoltaics: https://triplesolar.eu/en/introduction/ https://triplesolar.eu/en/introduction/ > The front side of the PVT heat pump panel is similar to a solar panel and has solar cells to generate electricity. The backside is a heat exchanger that supplies the energy source for the heat pump. The heat exchanger-collector collects energy form the ambient temperature and additionally from daylight and sunlight. Not sure how it does throughout the whole season.
Schroedingersat 4y ago
I believe Longi sell a 22.8% module. Individual cells run 26%.
aaron695 4y ago
[dead]

kristopolous 4y ago

That's fine, they look great. Realizing we've got stuff looking like that that generates freakin' electricity is amazing.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
positr0n 4y ago
Given the poorer efficiency, wouldn't it be better use of limited money and resources to put regular tiles on houses and normal solar panels somewhere else? (Honest question. I've always wondered why residential rooftop solar, especially since it's usually government subsidized, makes sense anywhere in the world.)
- ilyt 4y ago
  I mean if you own multiple properties, sure... But if it is your house and you don't want to compromise on look, it's a way.
- killingtime74 4y ago
  Money is being optimized if the land is not free. Solar panels are relatively inexpensive even if inefficient if the land is sufficiently expensive. Electricity cost can vary a lot. If you have a lot of expensive panels and don't have to hook up to the grid that can save a lot of money
- gamblor956 4y ago
  It's an historical site. The whole point of these tiles is that they visually fit in with the ruins. These are not tiles you would use for general solar production.
- kristopolous 4y ago
  "I've always wondered why residential rooftop solar, especially since it's usually government subsidized, makes sense anywhere in the world." Transmission isn't free and the surface is already there. Both places are fine.
- cmarschner 4y ago
  It makes sense to put nicer looking tiles on rooftops if you value the looks of them. You would then find normal looking tiles a tax. That‘s why it could make sense to put solar panels on roofs that don‘t impose this tax on you even if their efficiency is lower.
  - stavros 4y ago
    This answer is to "given that you want solar panels, why put tiles". I think the question is "given that you want tiles, why put solar panels".
- TheCapeGreek 4y ago
  It's useful for the NIMBYs and historical conservation areas.
  - gameman144 4y ago
    I mean, not wanting commercial solar farms in your back yard seems like one of the more reasonable things to not want in your back yard. Especially when aesthetically pleasing (if less efficient) rooftop solar fits the bill nicely.
- hgomersall 4y ago
  A properly designed house with solar can be energy neutral over the year in the UK (not notable for its sunny climate).
  - graphe 4y ago
    What does energy neutral mean? What does properly designed mean? And at what cost to comfort or the property? You could turn off all your electricity and heat yourself with kerosene and have used no electricity for the year.
    - pjc50 4y ago
      Usually means "passivehaus", and "energy neutral" would mean "generates an equal quantity of electricity to that consumed, when summed over the year". > heat yourself with kerosene That's not energy neutral, is it now, unless you have a kerosene well on the property.
      - graphe 4y ago
        Geothermal energy would be amazing! But it's hard to balance with carbon emissions.
      - hgomersall 4y ago
        Precisely - for a smallish 120sqm house the passivhaus heat demand is 1800kWh. 3000kWh is not unreasonable for additional electricity consumption. With a heat pump that heat demand should pessimistically translate into <1000kWh electricity, giving us a total energy usage of ~4000kWh. That's about what a medium size (~20sqm) south-facing roof-mounted PV installation would achieve in the south of the UK.
- graphe 4y ago
  It's an active volcano, you need to run power lines, the ground shifts, and it can blow any time. It makes sense to make your own power for yourself and you can sell it back to the grid.
- pjc50 4y ago
  Land tends to be expensive; it would be a real challenge in Europe to find somewhere that isn't being used already for some economic purpose, and also isn't a conservation area and/or physically inacessible or difficult to build on.
- Cthulhu_ 4y ago
  Why not both? SolarCity (now Tesla) had solar panels that looks like roof tiles. There's a lot of roof space in any town, it makes sense to use that instead of use up land (that could be used for housing or agriculture) for solar power generation. But it can be all of the above, too. More energy produced is not going to go to waste, and there's plenty of unusable areas like deserts where solar electricity can be generated in various ways.
- emiliobumachar 4y ago
  Adding to the great points already here, decentralized production makes the system more robust to accidents, terrorism, and war. Not immune by any stretch, but more robust.
marcyb5st 4y ago
Yeah, but they are also crazy expensive. From their website is 7k Euros for 1kW of installed capacity (not sure if the price includes then installation). I understand beauty factor, but damn. For Pompei it's perfect though

bloodyplonker22 4y ago

I have worked in the solar industry. As a reference, the average efficiency of "normal" solar panels is around 16% today.

galangalalgol 4y ago
Does that mean that in high intensity regions you'd need active cooling or is that not a problem?
- mcronce 4y ago
  This doesn't answer your question, but I really wish someone would offer off-the-shelf panels with tubing on the back to hook up water lines. It would be dope to cool my panels and preheat my hot water at the same time.
  - implements 4y ago
    "Rad" more than "dope" :) I've seen a DIY system where the panels are boxed in, and the hot air created behind the panels used for blown air / heat recovery heating.
  - ilyt 4y ago
    They are usually called "hybrid solar panels" and not exactly a new thing. Usually cheaper to just put more panels tho. Pretty handy if you need to get the most out of roof space but otherwise more panels + heat pump water heater is much simpler solution.
  - bruce511 4y ago
    They exist! For example: https://www.todoensolar.com/epages/61987244.mobile/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/61987244/Products/pvtcrane&Locale=en_GB https://www.todoensolar.com/epages/61987244.mobile/en_GB/?Ob...
  - duckmysick 4y ago
    There's one combining a heat exchanger and photovoltaics: https://triplesolar.eu/en/introduction/ https://triplesolar.eu/en/introduction/ > The front side of the PVT heat pump panel is similar to a solar panel and has solar cells to generate electricity. The backside is a heat exchanger that supplies the energy source for the heat pump. The heat exchanger-collector collects energy form the ambient temperature and additionally from daylight and sunlight. Not sure how it does throughout the whole season.

Schroedingersat 4y ago

I believe Longi sell a 22.8% module. Individual cells run 26%.

aaron695 4y ago

[dead]