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I've used Thunderbird exclusively for desktop mail for many years. To my knowledge, it still sucks less than any other free and open option, but that's not much

I've used Thunderbird exclusively for desktop mail for many years. To my knowledge, it still sucks less than any other free and open option, but that's not much of a bar. Over time, Thunderbird has become slower and less reliable, most notably in the area of search. While the advanced search tools are excellent, the results are lousy. Email that I know exists is often unfindable until I force Thunderbird to re-index my whole mailbox. Seeing F/OSS devs of (what I consider to be) a critical app like Thunderbird talk about "modernizing the interface" is the worst. The interface is fine and there are far bigger problems -- problems related to actual functionality as opposed to prettiness -- that desperately need work. And to echo others' comments: courting the "average user" is worse than a waste of resources, it's an active turning away from the core users and supporters.

Karellen 4y ago
> To my knowledge, [Thunderbird] still sucks less than any other free and open option, Have you tried Claws Mail? It's a plain native traditional email client, and I find it really snappy. There is even a Windows port. Not sure how "native" people might consider that as it's still based on GTK for Windows, and I don't have personal experience with it, but might be worth giving a try? https://www.claws-mail.org/downloads.php https://www.claws-mail.org/downloads.php
- tlamponi 4y ago
  Claws is really great, but it IME it lacked in getting the search results - I just never could find things as easily as in thunderbird; maybe I was not knowing how to "hold" it best yet, though. That said, I need to scan through a lot of mails for some specific things, thunderbird is barely getting a long with that anymore (the day I have to setup notmuch for real seems to be around the corner), so for most people Claws search may be easily good enough.
- pfp 4y ago
  Holy crap, this is amazing. I had already lost hope of finding a civilized email client. This is what all software should look like. Thank you.
donatzsky 4y ago
> The interface is fine and there are far bigger problems -- problems related to actual functionality as opposed to prettiness -- that desperately need work. You may want to read the blog post again. This isn't just about a new UI, it's about overhauling the codebase in general, so that they can improve all aspects.
- mr_machine 4y ago
  I get that, but they listed "Rebuild the interface from scratch..." as a separate bullet point from codebase issues, and later talked about "A UI that looks and feels modern is getting initially implemented...aiming at offering a simple and clean interface for “new” users..."
wpietri 4y ago
> Email that I know exists is often unfindable until I force Thunderbird to re-index my whole mailbox. Nice to have confirmation of this very irritating bug! When something isn't found in Thunderbird I now resort to searching in Fastmail's web interface.

Karellen 4y ago

> To my knowledge, [Thunderbird] still sucks less than any other free and open option, Have you tried Claws Mail? It's a plain native traditional email client, and I find it really snappy. There is even a Windows port. Not sure how "native" people might consider that as it's still based on GTK for Windows, and I don't have personal experience with it, but might be worth giving a try? https://www.claws-mail.org/downloads.php https://www.claws-mail.org/downloads.php

tlamponi 4y ago
Claws is really great, but it IME it lacked in getting the search results - I just never could find things as easily as in thunderbird; maybe I was not knowing how to "hold" it best yet, though. That said, I need to scan through a lot of mails for some specific things, thunderbird is barely getting a long with that anymore (the day I have to setup notmuch for real seems to be around the corner), so for most people Claws search may be easily good enough.
pfp 4y ago
Holy crap, this is amazing. I had already lost hope of finding a civilized email client. This is what all software should look like. Thank you.

donatzsky 4y ago

> The interface is fine and there are far bigger problems -- problems related to actual functionality as opposed to prettiness -- that desperately need work. You may want to read the blog post again. This isn't just about a new UI, it's about overhauling the codebase in general, so that they can improve all aspects.

mr_machine 4y ago
I get that, but they listed "Rebuild the interface from scratch..." as a separate bullet point from codebase issues, and later talked about "A UI that looks and feels modern is getting initially implemented...aiming at offering a simple and clean interface for “new” users..."

wpietri 4y ago

> Email that I know exists is often unfindable until I force Thunderbird to re-index my whole mailbox. Nice to have confirmation of this very irritating bug! When something isn't found in Thunderbird I now resort to searching in Fastmail's web interface.