3 ms·

> despite what gnome and apple proclaiming such a goal is impossible. GNOME? The great out the box experience... that also allows power users to deeply customi

> despite what gnome and apple proclaiming such a goal is impossible. GNOME? The great out the box experience... that also allows power users to deeply customize it? It is dishonest to lap GNOME (extremely popular free software) in with Apple (king of proprietary software).

skeletal88 4y ago
Gnome and customise? The DE that hates giving users any options to change stuff because they (Gnome) knows best?
- 2III7 4y ago
  That is why there is the Gnome Tweak tool and Gnome extensions. You get a great out-of-the-box experience for regular users and good customizability for advanced users. If you want extreme customizability just don't use Gnome. IMO Gnome gets way too much unwarranted critique here.
  - JohnFen 4y ago
    I don't use Gnome because I find its out-of-the-box experience to be pretty horrible. I couldn't figure out how to fix it, and didn't know about these tools. But it's fine, I'm really happy with the DE I use.
  - wkat4242 4y ago
    The problem with fixing all its problems with extensions is that they aren't always updated in time for new releases. And the tweak tool, sure but really the options in there should have been standard settings from the start. This is the core problem with this product.
    - anticensor 4y ago
      Sadly, the settings app crashes if you choose the performance power profile... Tweak tool, otoh, works fine.
peoplearepeople 4y ago
Gnome removed most buttons and menus that allow customization. You may be thinking of kde plasma instead
jseutter 4y ago
It's going back a few years now but the gnome 3 debacle is a reasonable example of not respecting users https://felipec.wordpress.com/2013/06/12/the-problem-with-gnome-3/ https://felipec.wordpress.com/2013/06/12/the-problem-with-gn... . I think in subsequent years the devs have been worn down and the community solved the missing features in other ways, but some people have long memories. gnome 3 is the primary reason Ubuntu got its own desktop system, it was that divisive. The Steam Deck is uniquely positioned to allow people to do potentially hazardous things like install software from unknown sources, and that is because it's primarily a gaming device. People aren't doing banking and work stuff on it, so what is the damage if it gets rooted? Valve could have easily screwed it up by building a walled garden anyways, just to satisfy corporate greed in the name of "maximizing ROI". Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo all have their walled gardens for gaming. The fact Valve hasn't (yet) is refreshing.
michaelmrose 4y ago
Apple is that stoic palace guard at Buckingham palace who says nothing and doesn't move or smile but won't let you leave the appointed tourist areas and bother the queen while GNOME is your obnoxious aunt who is always judging you. You know its wrong to want to theme your distros desktop don't you? It is such a bother that you always ask your file manager to wear green. You know he doesn't like that can't you see how uncomfortable you're making him? Prominent developers have variously spoken out against various user and distro customization suggesting that all theming and extensions be removed and even in one notable instance attempting to bully an app that supports many desktops to disable traditional tray icon functionality on other desktops using the dystopian phrasing something on the order of you should decide if you are a gnome app or a XFCE app. Another suggested that it would improve brand awareness if distros couldn't theme their version of gnome. Phrasing only a soulless marketing manager could possibly love. There can be little doubt that IBM/Red Hat is about as hostile to diversity of options on the Linux Desktop as Apple and not without cause. There are legitimate arguable benefits to a homogeneous ecosystem. They just aren't in quite the same position to dictate options. For instance killing the extension/themeing ecosystem would have empowered forks and as few people would be running gnome as run Fedora.

skeletal88 4y ago

Gnome and customise? The DE that hates giving users any options to change stuff because they (Gnome) knows best?

2III7 4y ago
That is why there is the Gnome Tweak tool and Gnome extensions. You get a great out-of-the-box experience for regular users and good customizability for advanced users. If you want extreme customizability just don't use Gnome. IMO Gnome gets way too much unwarranted critique here.
- JohnFen 4y ago
  I don't use Gnome because I find its out-of-the-box experience to be pretty horrible. I couldn't figure out how to fix it, and didn't know about these tools. But it's fine, I'm really happy with the DE I use.
- wkat4242 4y ago
  The problem with fixing all its problems with extensions is that they aren't always updated in time for new releases. And the tweak tool, sure but really the options in there should have been standard settings from the start. This is the core problem with this product.
  - anticensor 4y ago
    Sadly, the settings app crashes if you choose the performance power profile... Tweak tool, otoh, works fine.

peoplearepeople 4y ago

Gnome removed most buttons and menus that allow customization. You may be thinking of kde plasma instead

jseutter 4y ago

It's going back a few years now but the gnome 3 debacle is a reasonable example of not respecting users https://felipec.wordpress.com/2013/06/12/the-problem-with-gnome-3/ https://felipec.wordpress.com/2013/06/12/the-problem-with-gn... . I think in subsequent years the devs have been worn down and the community solved the missing features in other ways, but some people have long memories. gnome 3 is the primary reason Ubuntu got its own desktop system, it was that divisive. The Steam Deck is uniquely positioned to allow people to do potentially hazardous things like install software from unknown sources, and that is because it's primarily a gaming device. People aren't doing banking and work stuff on it, so what is the damage if it gets rooted? Valve could have easily screwed it up by building a walled garden anyways, just to satisfy corporate greed in the name of "maximizing ROI". Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo all have their walled gardens for gaming. The fact Valve hasn't (yet) is refreshing.

michaelmrose 4y ago

Apple is that stoic palace guard at Buckingham palace who says nothing and doesn't move or smile but won't let you leave the appointed tourist areas and bother the queen while GNOME is your obnoxious aunt who is always judging you. You know its wrong to want to theme your distros desktop don't you? It is such a bother that you always ask your file manager to wear green. You know he doesn't like that can't you see how uncomfortable you're making him? Prominent developers have variously spoken out against various user and distro customization suggesting that all theming and extensions be removed and even in one notable instance attempting to bully an app that supports many desktops to disable traditional tray icon functionality on other desktops using the dystopian phrasing something on the order of you should decide if you are a gnome app or a XFCE app. Another suggested that it would improve brand awareness if distros couldn't theme their version of gnome. Phrasing only a soulless marketing manager could possibly love. There can be little doubt that IBM/Red Hat is about as hostile to diversity of options on the Linux Desktop as Apple and not without cause. There are legitimate arguable benefits to a homogeneous ecosystem. They just aren't in quite the same position to dictate options. For instance killing the extension/themeing ecosystem would have empowered forks and as few people would be running gnome as run Fedora.