2 ms·

I agree that this is a serious issue. I know 3 kids who graduated in 2019 and got into top universities. Three years later -- One flatly refused to leave hom

I agree that this is a serious issue. I know 3 kids who graduated in 2019 and got into top universities. Three years later -- One flatly refused to leave home despite a lot of pushing from their parents. They are working at the local theater and taking community college courses here and there with no real future plans or goals -- One also decided to go to CC, with her parent's support this time. She's 21, just got married, and has decided to be a vet tech with the anticipation of being a SAH wife and mother.[0] -- One went to a top university and had a mental breakdown earlier this year - going back home and almost refusing to get out of bed or eat. Fortunately(?) this happened over a 4 week winter break, and with support from her parents and a prescription for anti-depressants she is back in school. Not very inspiring outcomes. I personally think that the pressure from high school really ended up convincing them that they never wanted to work that hard again. [0] I don't want to look down on women who wish to become SAHMs, but I think it's terribly short-sighted to make that decision at 21 and give up on pursuing a "real" career.

ndriscoll 4y ago
> I don't want to look down on women who wish to become SAHMs, but I think it's terribly short-sighted to make that decision at 21 and give up on pursuing a "real" career. Certainly it requires a lot of trust and commitment, but I wouldn't call it short-sighted. It's risky, but if you do find a good spouse, it's not like you're missing out on anything (my wife is a SAHM and has never had nor wanted a career). To me people that go to grad school and take on tons of debt, only to be in a position to try to start having kids in their late 30s/early 40s seem a lot more short-sighted. I watched some consumer interviews while I was at my last employer. The market segment we were interviewing were very high achieving people, but some of them were 38+ and saying they're thinking about having kids soon; there's like a 25% chance that ship has already sailed, even ignoring the reality of being almost 60 when they graduate from high school. I suppose it comes down to knowing what you want out of life and what will bring you satisfaction with the time you've got.
- nineplay 4y ago
  I don't trust a 21 year old to know if they've found a good spouse. I don't trust anyone to know if they've found a good spouse which is why I'd tell everyone, male or female, to have a career they can fall back to if something happens to their marriage. It might not just be a bad spouse, it might be a spouse who dies young and then a woman with multiple kids and a 10 year old vet tech degree has to figure out how on earth she's going to support herself. Life insurance only lasts so long. I'm old enough to have seen a lot of young happy couples turn into divorced bitter singles and I can't speak to the average experience but in my circle, the women end up screwed. They've got the kids, ( the ex wanted nothing to do with the kids ) they've got no income ( the ex either has no money or is fighting tooth and nail to avoid sending any money ) and they are living off of parents, friends, and social services trying to find some job they can do part time ( no daycare ) that has a hope of supporting them. Some of these women stayed in bad circumstances for a long time because they knew how hard it would be to manage without their spouse. Some women are still in terrible circumstances because they can't afford to leave. > some of them were 38+ and saying they're thinking about having kids soon; there's like a 25% chance that ship has already sailed, 25% is nonsense.
  - shard 4y ago
    >> some of them were 38+ and saying they're thinking about having kids soon; there's like a 25% chance that ship has already sailed, > 25% is nonsense. Yes, I think it's worse than that. "A woman in her early to mid-20s has a 25–30% chance of getting pregnant every month. Fertility generally starts to reduce when a woman is in her early 30s, and more so after the age of 35. By age 40, the chance of getting pregnant in any monthly cycle is around 5%." (https://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/health/conditionsandtreatments/age-and-fertility#womens-age-and-fertility https://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/health/conditionsandtrea...)
  - lmm 4y ago
    > I'm old enough to have seen a lot of young happy couples turn into divorced bitter singles and I can't speak to the average experience but in my circle, the women end up screwed. They've got the kids, ( the ex wanted nothing to do with the kids ) they've got no income ( the ex either has no money or is fighting tooth and nail to avoid sending any money ) and they are living off of parents, friends, and social services trying to find some job they can do part time ( no daycare ) that has a hope of supporting them. Are they better or worse than the lonely 40+ women who have careers and money but no hope of a partner or family?

ndriscoll 4y ago

> I don't want to look down on women who wish to become SAHMs, but I think it's terribly short-sighted to make that decision at 21 and give up on pursuing a "real" career. Certainly it requires a lot of trust and commitment, but I wouldn't call it short-sighted. It's risky, but if you do find a good spouse, it's not like you're missing out on anything (my wife is a SAHM and has never had nor wanted a career). To me people that go to grad school and take on tons of debt, only to be in a position to try to start having kids in their late 30s/early 40s seem a lot more short-sighted. I watched some consumer interviews while I was at my last employer. The market segment we were interviewing were very high achieving people, but some of them were 38+ and saying they're thinking about having kids soon; there's like a 25% chance that ship has already sailed, even ignoring the reality of being almost 60 when they graduate from high school. I suppose it comes down to knowing what you want out of life and what will bring you satisfaction with the time you've got.

nineplay 4y ago
I don't trust a 21 year old to know if they've found a good spouse. I don't trust anyone to know if they've found a good spouse which is why I'd tell everyone, male or female, to have a career they can fall back to if something happens to their marriage. It might not just be a bad spouse, it might be a spouse who dies young and then a woman with multiple kids and a 10 year old vet tech degree has to figure out how on earth she's going to support herself. Life insurance only lasts so long. I'm old enough to have seen a lot of young happy couples turn into divorced bitter singles and I can't speak to the average experience but in my circle, the women end up screwed. They've got the kids, ( the ex wanted nothing to do with the kids ) they've got no income ( the ex either has no money or is fighting tooth and nail to avoid sending any money ) and they are living off of parents, friends, and social services trying to find some job they can do part time ( no daycare ) that has a hope of supporting them. Some of these women stayed in bad circumstances for a long time because they knew how hard it would be to manage without their spouse. Some women are still in terrible circumstances because they can't afford to leave. > some of them were 38+ and saying they're thinking about having kids soon; there's like a 25% chance that ship has already sailed, 25% is nonsense.
- shard 4y ago
  >> some of them were 38+ and saying they're thinking about having kids soon; there's like a 25% chance that ship has already sailed, > 25% is nonsense. Yes, I think it's worse than that. "A woman in her early to mid-20s has a 25–30% chance of getting pregnant every month. Fertility generally starts to reduce when a woman is in her early 30s, and more so after the age of 35. By age 40, the chance of getting pregnant in any monthly cycle is around 5%." (https://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/health/conditionsandtreatments/age-and-fertility#womens-age-and-fertility https://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/health/conditionsandtrea...)
- lmm 4y ago
  > I'm old enough to have seen a lot of young happy couples turn into divorced bitter singles and I can't speak to the average experience but in my circle, the women end up screwed. They've got the kids, ( the ex wanted nothing to do with the kids ) they've got no income ( the ex either has no money or is fighting tooth and nail to avoid sending any money ) and they are living off of parents, friends, and social services trying to find some job they can do part time ( no daycare ) that has a hope of supporting them. Are they better or worse than the lonely 40+ women who have careers and money but no hope of a partner or family?