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One issue with that is that "aviation" includes a lot more than commercial airliners - it also includes inexpensive, Spartan general aviation aircraft. The cost

One issue with that is that "aviation" includes a lot more than commercial airliners - it also includes inexpensive, Spartan general aviation aircraft. The cost of such a system would be prohibitive. Just look at the rollout for ADS-B In/Out if you're curious how difficult that might be to implement.

knodi123 4y ago
Yeah, but at least at this airport, they almost always use separate runways. They COULD share, but that sounds like making perfection the enemy of improvement.
quest88 4y ago
Are there aircraft with cat3 approaches that aren’t commercial? I don’t know any any GA that do that.
- mulmen 4y ago
  Looks like the Piper M600, Daher TBM 940, and Cirrus Vision all have auto-land capabilities through the Garmin G3000 system. But it doesn’t seem to be as sophisticated as what is described for the airliners. It’s more of an emergency system.
mynegation 4y ago
At least one of the planes in this situation was equipped with the system that lands the plane automatically in almost zero visibility. It’s not a stretch of imagination to see how that can extend to the system that tracks planes on approach to the airport and steering on the ground and extrapolates their trajectories at least for the typical braking/abort time forward. These are not general aviation, these are planes carrying tons of cargo and hundreds of people.
- euroderf 4y ago
  Sounds like a job for... A.I.?
  - friendzis 4y ago
    No, no and no. Safety critical systems must be validated to be safe in the operational domain and for that they must be deterministic. AI is anything but that.
    - zaarn 4y ago
      AI is entirely deterministic. ChatGPT and StableDiffusion and friends are fed endless amounts of random seeds along with every input to keep them from just saying always the same thing.
      - nicky0 4y ago
        The output for a given input (absent random seeds) may be constant, but is the output deterministically correct?
        zaarn 4y ago
        What does that question even mean?
        friendzis 4y ago
        Roughly, they are asking whether you can take an AI system and effectively reduce it to an analytic function and tell, without actually running the AI, what the output is going to be with a particular input.
        nicky0 4y ago
        A generative AI may well be deterministic and generate repeatable output for a given inpiut, but that doesn't mean the output is correct for every input. It may merely generate the wrong answer consistently.
      - HPsquared 4y ago
        "Deterministic" only insofar as it's repeatable, but their behaviour is not predictable. If the behaviour is not predictable, how can it be validated as being correct?
- dghlsakjg 4y ago
  What you’re talking about is called a collision avoidance system and it exists and both of these planes have it. It doesn’t alert you to planes on the ground because it would never stop going off. How is the system supposed to know that the pilot approaching the threshold as you land is going to stop? It can’t so it would issue an immediate correction alert and you have to go around.

knodi123 4y ago

Yeah, but at least at this airport, they almost always use separate runways. They COULD share, but that sounds like making perfection the enemy of improvement.

quest88 4y ago

Are there aircraft with cat3 approaches that aren’t commercial? I don’t know any any GA that do that.

mulmen 4y ago
Looks like the Piper M600, Daher TBM 940, and Cirrus Vision all have auto-land capabilities through the Garmin G3000 system. But it doesn’t seem to be as sophisticated as what is described for the airliners. It’s more of an emergency system.

mynegation 4y ago

At least one of the planes in this situation was equipped with the system that lands the plane automatically in almost zero visibility. It’s not a stretch of imagination to see how that can extend to the system that tracks planes on approach to the airport and steering on the ground and extrapolates their trajectories at least for the typical braking/abort time forward. These are not general aviation, these are planes carrying tons of cargo and hundreds of people.

euroderf 4y ago
Sounds like a job for... A.I.?
- friendzis 4y ago
  No, no and no. Safety critical systems must be validated to be safe in the operational domain and for that they must be deterministic. AI is anything but that.
  - zaarn 4y ago
    AI is entirely deterministic. ChatGPT and StableDiffusion and friends are fed endless amounts of random seeds along with every input to keep them from just saying always the same thing.
    - nicky0 4y ago
      The output for a given input (absent random seeds) may be constant, but is the output deterministically correct?
      - zaarn 4y ago
        What does that question even mean?
        friendzis 4y ago
        Roughly, they are asking whether you can take an AI system and effectively reduce it to an analytic function and tell, without actually running the AI, what the output is going to be with a particular input.
        nicky0 4y ago
        A generative AI may well be deterministic and generate repeatable output for a given inpiut, but that doesn't mean the output is correct for every input. It may merely generate the wrong answer consistently.
    - HPsquared 4y ago
      "Deterministic" only insofar as it's repeatable, but their behaviour is not predictable. If the behaviour is not predictable, how can it be validated as being correct?
dghlsakjg 4y ago
What you’re talking about is called a collision avoidance system and it exists and both of these planes have it. It doesn’t alert you to planes on the ground because it would never stop going off. How is the system supposed to know that the pilot approaching the threshold as you land is going to stop? It can’t so it would issue an immediate correction alert and you have to go around.