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Qt development with C++ is slow. Development with QML means JS anyway (good luck finding JS devs with Qt experience) and still having to hire C++ devs too for n

by hajile 4y ago

Qt development with C++ is slow. Development with QML means JS anyway (good luck finding JS devs with Qt experience) and still having to hire C++ devs too for non trivial apps.

CyberDildonics 4y ago
Now you're changing your story. Before you said someone would have to "write versions of that app in several different languages/platforms." Qt development with C++ is slow. What are you basing that on? Development with QML means JS anyway That's actually only for parameters of the QML UI, which is a tiny part of working program. Actually the GUI that can be done through any library is a very tiny part of most programs. Declaring widgets and laying them out is not difficult or time consuming, there isn't much logic there. good luck finding JS devs with Qt experience Any competent C++ programmer can just start using javascript after a day or two of tutorials. There is no need to hire "a JS dev", you just hire a good programmer. Javascript is not that hard. Modern C++ is not even that hard, but as a language javascript is even easier. Anyone who calls themselves "a JS dev" is probably not that experienced to begin with. Learning languages is trivial to someone with experience. Have you ever made a GUI program with modern C++ and FLTK ? It's incredibly easy and the results are lightning quick while starting at 100KB.
- ozim 4y ago
  Have you ever tried to make c++ dev to code JavaScript? It is not like you can drop by and say “Joe tomorrow you also write JS”. Same for JS devs as it is not that they could not do c++. It is that now you require more so you have to pay them more. If you don’t - they will go to work in company where they do only JS.
  - CyberDildonics 4y ago
    Have you ever tried to make c++ dev to code JavaScript? Yeah, it's not something anyone considers an issue. It is not like you can drop by and say “Joe tomorrow you also write JS”. I've never even met a C++ programmer that didn't know javascript. Every one knew multiple scripting languages and javascript isn't that different. Where are you getting this idea that individual languages are difficult? Same for JS devs as it is not that they could not do c++. It is that now you require more so you have to pay them more. If you don’t - they will go to work in company where they do only JS. This view that knowing more than one language means anything is usually not held by professional programmers. My experience is that this is only an idea held by people who have just learned their first language and feel overwhelmed by learning anything else.
    - hajile 4y ago
      If you know C, it doesn't mean you are any good at Haskell, Prolog, Forth, Smalltalk, Lisp, or any other major paradigms. All of those introduce fundamental concepts that the C programmer simply does not know (I recommend learning all of these to expand your horizons as a programmer, but you meet very few devs that know or understand anything outside their narrow proceedural/OOP window). JS is a completely different paradigm from C++ mixing in functional programming with dynamic objects in a way that C++ simply cannot do things. If a C++ dev wanted to learn Python, they'd pick up and read some books on the subject. Same if they wanted to learn PHP, Java, Perl, C#, or whatever. But when it comes to JS, they just try to wing it. Their stuff kinda works, but they don't even realize that they are fighting the language every step of the way. As a result, they complain that JS is slow and the design sucks when the reality is that they don't understand, but have too much hubris to actually go back to school for a little while. I spent much of the early part of my JS career fixing the code written by these kinds of C++ devs. While they wrote amazing C++ code, the JS they wrote was a mess. I could rewrite their code in a fraction of the LOC while making it more readable and faster too.
      - CyberDildonics 4y ago
        JS is a completely different paradigm from C++ mixing in functional programming with dynamic objects in a way that C++ simply cannot do things. Where do these ideas come from? Every modern language has elements that were originally considered "functional". Good programmers will do well with any language. What are 'dynamic objects' and what is the way that 'C++ simple cannot do thing'? You make these claims without backing anything up. If a C++ dev wanted to learn Python, they'd pick up and read some books on the subject. Same if they wanted to learn PHP, Java, Perl, C#, or whatever. But when it comes to JS, they just try to wing it. Where are getting this from? Most programmers learn javascript before C++ because it's so easy to try things out in a web browser. Their stuff kinda works, but they don't even realize that they are fighting the language every step of the way. As a result, they complain that JS is slow and the design sucks when the reality is that they don't understand, but have too much hubris to actually go back to school for a little while. Who are you talking about? Is this describing a single person you met? these kinds of C++ devs. While they wrote amazing C++ code, the JS they wrote was a mess I have news for you, their C++ was probably terrible too. Even labeling someone as a "C++ dev" or "javascript dev" is a giant red flag of inexperience.

by hajile 4y ago

Qt development with C++ is slow. Development with QML means JS anyway (good luck finding JS devs with Qt experience) and still having to hire C++ devs too for non trivial apps.

CyberDildonics 4y ago

Now you're changing your story. Before you said someone would have to "write versions of that app in several different languages/platforms." Qt development with C++ is slow. What are you basing that on? Development with QML means JS anyway That's actually only for parameters of the QML UI, which is a tiny part of working program. Actually the GUI that can be done through any library is a very tiny part of most programs. Declaring widgets and laying them out is not difficult or time consuming, there isn't much logic there. good luck finding JS devs with Qt experience Any competent C++ programmer can just start using javascript after a day or two of tutorials. There is no need to hire "a JS dev", you just hire a good programmer. Javascript is not that hard. Modern C++ is not even that hard, but as a language javascript is even easier. Anyone who calls themselves "a JS dev" is probably not that experienced to begin with. Learning languages is trivial to someone with experience. Have you ever made a GUI program with modern C++ and FLTK ? It's incredibly easy and the results are lightning quick while starting at 100KB.

ozim 4y ago
Have you ever tried to make c++ dev to code JavaScript? It is not like you can drop by and say “Joe tomorrow you also write JS”. Same for JS devs as it is not that they could not do c++. It is that now you require more so you have to pay them more. If you don’t - they will go to work in company where they do only JS.
- CyberDildonics 4y ago
  Have you ever tried to make c++ dev to code JavaScript? Yeah, it's not something anyone considers an issue. It is not like you can drop by and say “Joe tomorrow you also write JS”. I've never even met a C++ programmer that didn't know javascript. Every one knew multiple scripting languages and javascript isn't that different. Where are you getting this idea that individual languages are difficult? Same for JS devs as it is not that they could not do c++. It is that now you require more so you have to pay them more. If you don’t - they will go to work in company where they do only JS. This view that knowing more than one language means anything is usually not held by professional programmers. My experience is that this is only an idea held by people who have just learned their first language and feel overwhelmed by learning anything else.
  - hajile 4y ago
    If you know C, it doesn't mean you are any good at Haskell, Prolog, Forth, Smalltalk, Lisp, or any other major paradigms. All of those introduce fundamental concepts that the C programmer simply does not know (I recommend learning all of these to expand your horizons as a programmer, but you meet very few devs that know or understand anything outside their narrow proceedural/OOP window). JS is a completely different paradigm from C++ mixing in functional programming with dynamic objects in a way that C++ simply cannot do things. If a C++ dev wanted to learn Python, they'd pick up and read some books on the subject. Same if they wanted to learn PHP, Java, Perl, C#, or whatever. But when it comes to JS, they just try to wing it. Their stuff kinda works, but they don't even realize that they are fighting the language every step of the way. As a result, they complain that JS is slow and the design sucks when the reality is that they don't understand, but have too much hubris to actually go back to school for a little while. I spent much of the early part of my JS career fixing the code written by these kinds of C++ devs. While they wrote amazing C++ code, the JS they wrote was a mess. I could rewrite their code in a fraction of the LOC while making it more readable and faster too.
    - CyberDildonics 4y ago
      JS is a completely different paradigm from C++ mixing in functional programming with dynamic objects in a way that C++ simply cannot do things. Where do these ideas come from? Every modern language has elements that were originally considered "functional". Good programmers will do well with any language. What are 'dynamic objects' and what is the way that 'C++ simple cannot do thing'? You make these claims without backing anything up. If a C++ dev wanted to learn Python, they'd pick up and read some books on the subject. Same if they wanted to learn PHP, Java, Perl, C#, or whatever. But when it comes to JS, they just try to wing it. Where are getting this from? Most programmers learn javascript before C++ because it's so easy to try things out in a web browser. Their stuff kinda works, but they don't even realize that they are fighting the language every step of the way. As a result, they complain that JS is slow and the design sucks when the reality is that they don't understand, but have too much hubris to actually go back to school for a little while. Who are you talking about? Is this describing a single person you met? these kinds of C++ devs. While they wrote amazing C++ code, the JS they wrote was a mess I have news for you, their C++ was probably terrible too. Even labeling someone as a "C++ dev" or "javascript dev" is a giant red flag of inexperience.