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Most people that live in a HCOL city cannot just move to a LCOL city and get paid the same - you think they've never considered that? The point of using the na

Most people that live in a HCOL city cannot just move to a LCOL city and get paid the same - you think they've never considered that? The point of using the national average is that we can compare it to other careers. If we compare game devs to other software development positions they get paid significantly less on average. The BLS puts software engineers at an average of $109k for 2021 (couldn't find 2022 stats, not sure if they exist yet?)[1]. That means game devs make 20+% less on average compared to their non-game counterparts. 1: https://www.bls.gov/ooh/Computer-and-Information-Technology/Software-developers.htm https://www.bls.gov/ooh/Computer-and-Information-Technology/...

lll-o-lll 4y ago
Well what would you expect? The work is significantly simpler, and the conditions are much better. So… wait. That’s not quite right. Hmmm. Try again. What would you expect? The value to the employer is significantly lower because each developers contribution is… No wait. Tell me again how this capitalism thing works because I get confused?
- anon7725 4y ago
  Supply impacts wages. More people want to be game devs per open position than want to be non-game devs per open position.
  - lll-o-lll 4y ago
    Right, right. So it’s just supply and demand. So here in Australia where the number of surgeon positions are constrained by a centralised body, supply outstrips demand quite a bit. Let me google the old market at work! Googling… Hmmm… Are you sure this thing is working?
    - hahaxdxd123 4y ago
      > are constrained by a centralised body > supply outstrips demand quite a bit How does that follow? It is constrained therefore supply is artifically lowered. No matter the demand, no one can supply more doctors than the body permits, therefore the price for each is quite high.
      - deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
      - lll-o-lll 4y ago
        Not demand for the services, that’s high. Supply of talented humans for the role is much much greater than the positions available. So based on the aforementioned logic; lots of competition for limited spots should reduce the wages paid right?
        anon7725 4y ago
        The medical licensing body is making the market in surgeons. Their interest is in keeping wages high and supply low. In fact, “making the market” is not even the right analogy - the licensing body is the sole supplier of surgeons. Nobody is making the market in game devs, so market wages prevail. Gaming happens to be the world’s most popular form of entertainment so it’s not surprising that more people want to be game devs than say write ERP software. There are also way fewer game dev jobs than there are general dev jobs. This isn’t rocket science.
        Kubuxu 4y ago
        Yes, that is why residents are paid pennies. But once you are fully qualified surgeon, your are in the artificially limited pool of people who can operate on patients. Which leads to high salaries for surgeons.
    - ChuckNorris89 4y ago
      Surgeons and game devs are not comparable. There's no free market in medicine in most countries as the doctors have formed their own cartel/union which decides who gets to be let in and under which conditions and without membership to that tribe you cannot practice.
      - lll-o-lll 4y ago
        So why doesn’t every group with valuable skills form similar cartels? Why isn’t there some “game dev” certification body to achieve the same? Now I understand what this Chartered Professional Engineer thing is all about! It’s a license to print money by controlling supply! I want in!
        ChuckNorris89 4y ago
        Because SW devs never wanted to unionize in any way as they say they'll get held back by unions and they'll make more compensation without them. And no, most chartered engineers do not really print money, some making even less than SW devs. In my insignificant EU country, nearly every profession has it's own labor union, and guess what, the IT union is one of the weakest, seeing some of the worst possible contract terms and work conditions for a skilled profession, while the metal workers union being one of the strongest, having some of the best perks, rights, working conditions and mandatory wage increases in the country.
        lll-o-lll 4y ago
        It’s not a dirty leftist union, it’s a certification body to ensure the high ethical and professional standards of our members! We can have cool ceremonies! Stuff to hang on your wall! A club house!
        nsvd 4y ago
        Well, it's hard to get in, which is the whole point.
- 8note 4y ago
  Your pay is defined by your colleagues and potential colleagues, and unrelated to the value you provide

lll-o-lll 4y ago

Well what would you expect? The work is significantly simpler, and the conditions are much better. So… wait. That’s not quite right. Hmmm. Try again. What would you expect? The value to the employer is significantly lower because each developers contribution is… No wait. Tell me again how this capitalism thing works because I get confused?

anon7725 4y ago
Supply impacts wages. More people want to be game devs per open position than want to be non-game devs per open position.
- lll-o-lll 4y ago
  Right, right. So it’s just supply and demand. So here in Australia where the number of surgeon positions are constrained by a centralised body, supply outstrips demand quite a bit. Let me google the old market at work! Googling… Hmmm… Are you sure this thing is working?
  - hahaxdxd123 4y ago
    > are constrained by a centralised body > supply outstrips demand quite a bit How does that follow? It is constrained therefore supply is artifically lowered. No matter the demand, no one can supply more doctors than the body permits, therefore the price for each is quite high.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - lll-o-lll 4y ago
      Not demand for the services, that’s high. Supply of talented humans for the role is much much greater than the positions available. So based on the aforementioned logic; lots of competition for limited spots should reduce the wages paid right?
      - anon7725 4y ago
        The medical licensing body is making the market in surgeons. Their interest is in keeping wages high and supply low. In fact, “making the market” is not even the right analogy - the licensing body is the sole supplier of surgeons. Nobody is making the market in game devs, so market wages prevail. Gaming happens to be the world’s most popular form of entertainment so it’s not surprising that more people want to be game devs than say write ERP software. There are also way fewer game dev jobs than there are general dev jobs. This isn’t rocket science.
      - Kubuxu 4y ago
        Yes, that is why residents are paid pennies. But once you are fully qualified surgeon, your are in the artificially limited pool of people who can operate on patients. Which leads to high salaries for surgeons.
  - ChuckNorris89 4y ago
    Surgeons and game devs are not comparable. There's no free market in medicine in most countries as the doctors have formed their own cartel/union which decides who gets to be let in and under which conditions and without membership to that tribe you cannot practice.
    - lll-o-lll 4y ago
      So why doesn’t every group with valuable skills form similar cartels? Why isn’t there some “game dev” certification body to achieve the same? Now I understand what this Chartered Professional Engineer thing is all about! It’s a license to print money by controlling supply! I want in!
      - ChuckNorris89 4y ago
        Because SW devs never wanted to unionize in any way as they say they'll get held back by unions and they'll make more compensation without them. And no, most chartered engineers do not really print money, some making even less than SW devs. In my insignificant EU country, nearly every profession has it's own labor union, and guess what, the IT union is one of the weakest, seeing some of the worst possible contract terms and work conditions for a skilled profession, while the metal workers union being one of the strongest, having some of the best perks, rights, working conditions and mandatory wage increases in the country.
        lll-o-lll 4y ago
        It’s not a dirty leftist union, it’s a certification body to ensure the high ethical and professional standards of our members! We can have cool ceremonies! Stuff to hang on your wall! A club house!
      - nsvd 4y ago
        Well, it's hard to get in, which is the whole point.
8note 4y ago
Your pay is defined by your colleagues and potential colleagues, and unrelated to the value you provide