4 ms·

Light 'em up. You can't send huge flying things across another country's airspace without permission and flight plans. I don't know, maybe the USA should star

Light 'em up. You can't send huge flying things across another country's airspace without permission and flight plans. I don't know, maybe the USA should start flying planes over Moscow and Beijing. How do you think they'd react? I don't get what the pushback against blowing up a balloon would be. If I was president, I'd make sure I'd be flying balloons over China all the time, see how they like it. shit, they are getting pissy about ships being in the South China Sea. Fuck China.

abenga 4y ago
Do you honestly believe there are no, nor have there ever been, American spy drones and planes flying over Moscow/Beijing?
- FrontierPsych 4y ago
  In 1960, "a United States U-2 spy plane was shot down by the Soviet Air Defence Forces" It's ok to try, but expect your shit to be shot down if you're a dick about it. Nothing happened when the U2 was shot down. But I personally am ok with the Soviet Union shooting it out of the sky. Why should the USA do nothing when a balloon, by a massive military power and the USA's new competitor, fly over the USA without a polite, "Hey, do you mind if we fly this "weather balloon" with cameras over your military installations?" I admit Americans have, and have been shot down. Why is it so weird the other way around? Why are you defending China indirectly by trying to equate it with the USA? If the USA gets shot down, why is that not mentioned by you and others? What's good for the goose is good for the gander. And, China certainly is getting weird about not having people sail ships through the South China Sea, despite it being ruled as international waters.
foverzar 4y ago
Who says you aren't? Googling with a date range filter set (to filter out recent Chinese balloon news) yields results like "Pentagon using spy balloons". We'll have to see if China starts shooting down random civilian (or not) probes within a few months. Many countries try not to fuss about stuff other countries do to avoid unnecessary escalations and tensions.
calyth2018 4y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1960_U-2_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1960_U-2_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_SR-71_Blackbird https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_SR-71_Blackbird You think the US doesn't do that now? If you do, I'd like to sell you the Brooklyn Bridge.
- FrontierPsych 4y ago
  You left the important part out: "a United States U-2 spy plane was *shot down* by the Soviet Air Defence Forces" I have zero idea why people are defending China, while the USA gets their aircraft shot down. Each country has sovereignty over their own airspace. And China is all weird about not wanting ships in the South China Sea despite it being ruled international waters. Why are you giving China a pass and holding the USA to different rules?
  - calyth2018 4y ago
    Outside of the handful that was shot down, including the ones that were operated by the ROC in the late 70s, all the major power that has the means of doing this, to probe defenses, be it coastal, or inland AA, or whatever, have done this. Who says I'm giving China a pass? My point is that it's a balloon that was tracked from Alaska long before it crossed BC into Montana probably had its risk assessment done. It wasn't worth the hassle, and the potential risk of letting them get the telemetry on military hardware, and the cost to shoot one of those balloons; or to reveal the true operating envelope of a fighter and its armaments over a balloon that the US already was comfortable with it flying around from Alaska on. If it was a serious threat to US national security, it would have been blown up over Alaska, or better yet, tell the Canadians to do it so that the risk isn't borne over American soil.
    - FrontierPsych 4y ago
      What you say may or may not be true, but it is beside the point. The point is that the USA, or any country, has the right to deny it's airspace to anyone. There is no rule that just because we let it fly through Montana that means the USA has to let it fly anywhere. There are all kinds of instances of the USA being denied use of another country's airspace. I'm not quite sure on the exact situation as it was a while ago, but I think during Gulf War I, or maybe II, Turkey would not let the USA take off from Incerirlick Air Base to bomb Iraq. Ah, here it is,they closed their airspace for a while in Gulf War II - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/mar/20/iraq.helenasmith https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/mar/20/iraq.helenasmi... It seems like you are giving China a pass to me. >If it was a serious threat to US national security, it would have been blown up over Alaska Nope. USA has the right to do it anywhere. We don't know the strategy. Maybe there was some global strategic reason or tactical reason, or who knows? Neither of us is the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, or are the Secretary of Defense. What do we know? All I know is that the USA can shoot down any aircraft, at any time, for any reason, if it doesn't file a flight plan and let the USA know the purpose. That I know. But you saying "If it was a serious threat to US national security..." is silly. You are not the Secretary of Defense. How would you know? Or anyone know, unless privy to that information? That's how it works.

abenga 4y ago

Do you honestly believe there are no, nor have there ever been, American spy drones and planes flying over Moscow/Beijing?

FrontierPsych 4y ago
In 1960, "a United States U-2 spy plane was shot down by the Soviet Air Defence Forces" It's ok to try, but expect your shit to be shot down if you're a dick about it. Nothing happened when the U2 was shot down. But I personally am ok with the Soviet Union shooting it out of the sky. Why should the USA do nothing when a balloon, by a massive military power and the USA's new competitor, fly over the USA without a polite, "Hey, do you mind if we fly this "weather balloon" with cameras over your military installations?" I admit Americans have, and have been shot down. Why is it so weird the other way around? Why are you defending China indirectly by trying to equate it with the USA? If the USA gets shot down, why is that not mentioned by you and others? What's good for the goose is good for the gander. And, China certainly is getting weird about not having people sail ships through the South China Sea, despite it being ruled as international waters.

foverzar 4y ago

Who says you aren't? Googling with a date range filter set (to filter out recent Chinese balloon news) yields results like "Pentagon using spy balloons". We'll have to see if China starts shooting down random civilian (or not) probes within a few months. Many countries try not to fuss about stuff other countries do to avoid unnecessary escalations and tensions.

calyth2018 4y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1960_U-2_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1960_U-2_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_SR-71_Blackbird https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_SR-71_Blackbird You think the US doesn't do that now? If you do, I'd like to sell you the Brooklyn Bridge.

FrontierPsych 4y ago
You left the important part out: "a United States U-2 spy plane was *shot down* by the Soviet Air Defence Forces" I have zero idea why people are defending China, while the USA gets their aircraft shot down. Each country has sovereignty over their own airspace. And China is all weird about not wanting ships in the South China Sea despite it being ruled international waters. Why are you giving China a pass and holding the USA to different rules?
- calyth2018 4y ago
  Outside of the handful that was shot down, including the ones that were operated by the ROC in the late 70s, all the major power that has the means of doing this, to probe defenses, be it coastal, or inland AA, or whatever, have done this. Who says I'm giving China a pass? My point is that it's a balloon that was tracked from Alaska long before it crossed BC into Montana probably had its risk assessment done. It wasn't worth the hassle, and the potential risk of letting them get the telemetry on military hardware, and the cost to shoot one of those balloons; or to reveal the true operating envelope of a fighter and its armaments over a balloon that the US already was comfortable with it flying around from Alaska on. If it was a serious threat to US national security, it would have been blown up over Alaska, or better yet, tell the Canadians to do it so that the risk isn't borne over American soil.
  - FrontierPsych 4y ago
    What you say may or may not be true, but it is beside the point. The point is that the USA, or any country, has the right to deny it's airspace to anyone. There is no rule that just because we let it fly through Montana that means the USA has to let it fly anywhere. There are all kinds of instances of the USA being denied use of another country's airspace. I'm not quite sure on the exact situation as it was a while ago, but I think during Gulf War I, or maybe II, Turkey would not let the USA take off from Incerirlick Air Base to bomb Iraq. Ah, here it is,they closed their airspace for a while in Gulf War II - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/mar/20/iraq.helenasmith https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/mar/20/iraq.helenasmi... It seems like you are giving China a pass to me. >If it was a serious threat to US national security, it would have been blown up over Alaska Nope. USA has the right to do it anywhere. We don't know the strategy. Maybe there was some global strategic reason or tactical reason, or who knows? Neither of us is the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, or are the Secretary of Defense. What do we know? All I know is that the USA can shoot down any aircraft, at any time, for any reason, if it doesn't file a flight plan and let the USA know the purpose. That I know. But you saying "If it was a serious threat to US national security..." is silly. You are not the Secretary of Defense. How would you know? Or anyone know, unless privy to that information? That's how it works.