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I think the government got reelected because that's what people want. Talk to a sufficient number of dutch people outside randstad and you will hear so many tim

by yread 4y ago

I think the government got reelected because that's what people want. Talk to a sufficient number of dutch people outside randstad and you will hear so many times about how the country is full and how there is no Christmas tree when king has a a speech and how there are too many muslims - these people used to constantly talk about how the benefits are being misused and how immigrants are having kids just to receive money and so on. These people are not that concerned about the whole toeslagenaffaire. They might use it to critize the government but the system worked in their eyes.

jacquesm 4y ago
Yes, this is a huge factor. Lots of fear of the 'other' here outside of the big cities (and plenty inside them) so going after the refugees and the immigrants is quite popular with a certain demographic.
- concordDance 4y ago
  Is it rational of them to go after said demographics? Does the existence of such people in the country worsen or improve their lives?
  - unglaublich 4y ago
    Acting on demographics based on statistics is called discrimination and it is a crime. Everyone - also members of a demographic that is statistically over-represented in criminal behavior - is innocent, unless proven otherwise, on an individual basis. To put that into perspective: young men are much more likely to commit crimes than any other group. Yet we all agree that we shouldn't discriminate against young men.
    - concordDance 4y ago
      > Yet we all agree that we shouldn't discriminate against young men. This definitely isn't a universal sentiment. > Acting on demographics based on statistics is called discrimination and it is a crime Not if the government does it. E.g. the vast majority of Russians would not be spies, but Ukraine still isn't letting Russians into the country.
  - em500 4y ago
    That's a question not even genuinely smart academic economists (not those who play ecomomist on CNN/Bloomberg) who study such for living can answer, let alone the median citizen. It's like asking if the immigrants / documented, NAFTA or trade with China worsen or improve the lives of American citizens.
- blub 4y ago
  Fraud is the least of Netherland’s problems: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jul/03/mob-style-killings-shock-netherlands-into-fighting-descent-into-narco-state https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jul/03/mob-style-kill... “While Dutch criminal gangs have been dubbed the “Mocro [Moroccan] Maffia” and ethnic minorities are overrepresented as crime suspects, Statistics Netherlands researchers say racial background is less important than age, education and socioeconomics.” Sometimes simple people manage to see the obvious things that the intellectuals are purposefully missing: Europe’s brainless migration strategy accepted anyone with a pulse instead of focusing on skilled workers. These poor and uneducated migrants were isolated in ghettos and turned to crime as an escape. Now Western Europe’s haunted by “clans” and “troubled youths” while many politicians and the media still haven’t found a way to address the problem without - God forbid - appearing racist.

by yread 4y ago

jacquesm 4y ago

Yes, this is a huge factor. Lots of fear of the 'other' here outside of the big cities (and plenty inside them) so going after the refugees and the immigrants is quite popular with a certain demographic.

concordDance 4y ago
Is it rational of them to go after said demographics? Does the existence of such people in the country worsen or improve their lives?
- unglaublich 4y ago
  Acting on demographics based on statistics is called discrimination and it is a crime. Everyone - also members of a demographic that is statistically over-represented in criminal behavior - is innocent, unless proven otherwise, on an individual basis. To put that into perspective: young men are much more likely to commit crimes than any other group. Yet we all agree that we shouldn't discriminate against young men.
  - concordDance 4y ago
    > Yet we all agree that we shouldn't discriminate against young men. This definitely isn't a universal sentiment. > Acting on demographics based on statistics is called discrimination and it is a crime Not if the government does it. E.g. the vast majority of Russians would not be spies, but Ukraine still isn't letting Russians into the country.
- em500 4y ago
  That's a question not even genuinely smart academic economists (not those who play ecomomist on CNN/Bloomberg) who study such for living can answer, let alone the median citizen. It's like asking if the immigrants / documented, NAFTA or trade with China worsen or improve the lives of American citizens.
blub 4y ago
Fraud is the least of Netherland’s problems: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jul/03/mob-style-killings-shock-netherlands-into-fighting-descent-into-narco-state https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jul/03/mob-style-kill... “While Dutch criminal gangs have been dubbed the “Mocro [Moroccan] Maffia” and ethnic minorities are overrepresented as crime suspects, Statistics Netherlands researchers say racial background is less important than age, education and socioeconomics.” Sometimes simple people manage to see the obvious things that the intellectuals are purposefully missing: Europe’s brainless migration strategy accepted anyone with a pulse instead of focusing on skilled workers. These poor and uneducated migrants were isolated in ghettos and turned to crime as an escape. Now Western Europe’s haunted by “clans” and “troubled youths” while many politicians and the media still haven’t found a way to address the problem without - God forbid - appearing racist.