4 ms·

Wow, 1100 kidnappings and still re-elected. Bleak!

jacquesm 4y ago
Yes, I still find this absolutely unbelievable. And our PM pretty much pretends that it never happened, and that his re-election absolves him of any and all responsibility.
- Doxin 4y ago
  If that man says "I have no active recollection" one more time
  - jacquesm 4y ago
    Precisely. Politicians whose memory is faulty should resign and stay resigned.
bboygravity 4y ago
One reason is media consistently referred to the kidnappings as "the scandal" without explaining much of what actually happened to people (especially on evening news). Another reason is that the majority of Dutch culture/society treats the state-sponsored "independent" media as a church of truth. The majority doesn't question them and all the media did (on purpose?) by repeatedly talking about "the scandal" superficially is just make people tired of hearing about it without knowing what it's actually about. I think this lays at the core of why they where re-elected (for the 3rd or 4th time).
- Dalewyn 4y ago
  Every time shit like this comes around, I am vindicated in my belief that facts and truths are two seemingly identical but actually very different things.
  - forgotmyname2 4y ago
    I can very much recommend "On Lying and Politics" by Hannah Arendt if you are interested in an essay on the difference. Well-written and extremely relevant today!
Freak_NL 4y ago
That's because that number alone is meaningless. Children are placed outside of their family whenever their custodians harm their well-being (with a judge's warrant). This is desirable on the whole. Of those 1100, a certain percentage would have been placed outside of the custody of their parents with or without this scandal, for just reasons. That's the key here. There will have been a number of cases where the child's environment would not have changed for the worse, had this affair not happened. Financial troubles tend to exacerbate existing issues. Several of these cases have been reported on in-depth in various (reliable) Dutch media, despite what some people might decry. Those cases are inexcusable, but they do not, according to what is known now at least, form the majority of these 1100 cases, or even a significant part. Anyone who speaks of '1100 kidnappings' is either naive or pushing some other narrative.
- nibbleshifter 4y ago
  The "bar" for social services to remove a child is extremely low - by design. There's zero repercussions or compensation if the state wrongly removes your child. There's a massive shitshow if they fail to remove your child and "something happens". So the system tends to trend on the side of taking children into care (traumatic for everyone involved) prematurely.
  - Freak_NL 4y ago
    That risk exists, but that's not limited to this specific affair.
    - nibbleshifter 4y ago
      Its highly relevant to this affair though. When you are charged or accused for a crime (say, welfare fraud), social services pretty much always automatically step in if there are children in the household. Then the "remove child" decision tree really gets going - with social services assuming guilt due to it being their safest option.
      - 4y ago

Yes, I still find this absolutely unbelievable. And our PM pretty much pretends that it never happened, and that his re-election absolves him of any and all responsibility.

Doxin 4y ago
If that man says "I have no active recollection" one more time
- jacquesm 4y ago
  Precisely. Politicians whose memory is faulty should resign and stay resigned.

bboygravity 4y ago

One reason is media consistently referred to the kidnappings as "the scandal" without explaining much of what actually happened to people (especially on evening news). Another reason is that the majority of Dutch culture/society treats the state-sponsored "independent" media as a church of truth. The majority doesn't question them and all the media did (on purpose?) by repeatedly talking about "the scandal" superficially is just make people tired of hearing about it without knowing what it's actually about. I think this lays at the core of why they where re-elected (for the 3rd or 4th time).

Dalewyn 4y ago
Every time shit like this comes around, I am vindicated in my belief that facts and truths are two seemingly identical but actually very different things.
- forgotmyname2 4y ago
  I can very much recommend "On Lying and Politics" by Hannah Arendt if you are interested in an essay on the difference. Well-written and extremely relevant today!

Freak_NL 4y ago

That's because that number alone is meaningless. Children are placed outside of their family whenever their custodians harm their well-being (with a judge's warrant). This is desirable on the whole. Of those 1100, a certain percentage would have been placed outside of the custody of their parents with or without this scandal, for just reasons. That's the key here. There will have been a number of cases where the child's environment would not have changed for the worse, had this affair not happened. Financial troubles tend to exacerbate existing issues. Several of these cases have been reported on in-depth in various (reliable) Dutch media, despite what some people might decry. Those cases are inexcusable, but they do not, according to what is known now at least, form the majority of these 1100 cases, or even a significant part. Anyone who speaks of '1100 kidnappings' is either naive or pushing some other narrative.

nibbleshifter 4y ago
The "bar" for social services to remove a child is extremely low - by design. There's zero repercussions or compensation if the state wrongly removes your child. There's a massive shitshow if they fail to remove your child and "something happens". So the system tends to trend on the side of taking children into care (traumatic for everyone involved) prematurely.
- Freak_NL 4y ago
  That risk exists, but that's not limited to this specific affair.
  - nibbleshifter 4y ago
    Its highly relevant to this affair though. When you are charged or accused for a crime (say, welfare fraud), social services pretty much always automatically step in if there are children in the household. Then the "remove child" decision tree really gets going - with social services assuming guilt due to it being their safest option.
    - 4y ago