4 ms·

It's not about warm and cuddly. It's about everyone understanding the ground rules. When there were incidents like the Cuban missile crisis it was because the g

It's not about warm and cuddly. It's about everyone understanding the ground rules. When there were incidents like the Cuban missile crisis it was because the ground rules weren't clear to all the players. The Soviets didn't think the US would react the way it did. In the Able Archer crisis we didn't understand the Soviets would react to NATO exercises as if it was preparation for nuclear war. I think we exist today is mainly down to the fact that for most of the Cold War, everyone understood what was in bounds and what wasn't.

WalterBright 4y ago
I give Kennedy credit for being the 2nd greatest American President because he averted nuclear war during the Cuban Missile Crisis.
- moose_man 4y ago
  Definitely lucky that there was someone like Kennedy in charge instead of someone like Nixon. I think the scariest part of the crisis, is neither the Soviet or the US leadership knew how close we were to going over the edge. https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2022/10/27/23426482/cuban-missile-crisis-basilica-arkhipov-nuclear-war https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2022/10/27/23426482/cuban... "The end in this case meant not just the fate of the submarine and its crew, but potentially the entire world. Cut off from outside contact, buffeted by depth charges, its air conditioning broken, and temperatures and carbon dioxide levels rising in the sub, the most obvious conclusion for the officers of B-59 was that global war had already begun. But the sub had a weapon at its disposal that US officers didn’t know about: a 10-kiloton nuclear torpedo. And its officers had permission from their superiors to launch it without confirmation from Moscow. Two of the sub’s senior officers wanted to launch the nuclear torpedo. That included its captain, Valentin Savitsky, who according to a report from the US National Security Archive, exclaimed: “We’re gonna blast them now! We will die, but we will sink them all — we will not become the shame of the fleet.”"
  - nyolfen 4y ago
    lol, nixon? the guy who withdrew from vietnam? did you mean johnson?
    - moose_man 4y ago
      I talking about the guy who told his aides to tell world leaders he was mentally unstable and might nuke someone for fun. The guy who put staying in office over the health of the country until there was no option for him.
      - nyolfen 4y ago
        yes, if there's one thing richard nixon was known for it was radically disproportionate military response, such as the time he nuked china
    - mc32 4y ago
      While Kennedy had certain patriotism about him and cared for the country despite some questionable stuff (like his dad's business and appointing his brother as AG) he did have some medical conditions which necessitated some significant medications which affected his mood, thinking and judgement. It's no wonder the deep state disliked him so much.
    - mrguyorama 4y ago
      Nixon had many incidents where he got very drunk and would get on the phone to important people and tell them to nuke, like, whoever he felt like at the time.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- yesenadam 4y ago
  (I'm not sure that's not a joke.) It seems the credit actually should go to Vasili Arkhipov. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasily_Arkhipov https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasily_Arkhipov
beebmam 4y ago
That's the point of the cold war: management through deterrence, stated retaliatory policies, and diplomacy. Cold wars are GOOD. Cold wars are how you prevent hot wars, and also how you prevent powerful aggressive countries from annexing and colonizing people at will.
- moose_man 4y ago
  Exactly, deterrence is a guardrail preventing conflict. It's the most important buffer. The last thing you want is for one side to try their luck on an offensive move.
foverzar 4y ago
> When there were incidents like the Cuban missile crisis it was because the ground rules weren't clear to all the players. The Soviets didn't think the US would react the way it did Missiles in Cuba were a USSRs response to US nukes in Turkey, so I am not sure I understand your point.

WalterBright 4y ago

I give Kennedy credit for being the 2nd greatest American President because he averted nuclear war during the Cuban Missile Crisis.

moose_man 4y ago
Definitely lucky that there was someone like Kennedy in charge instead of someone like Nixon. I think the scariest part of the crisis, is neither the Soviet or the US leadership knew how close we were to going over the edge. https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2022/10/27/23426482/cuban-missile-crisis-basilica-arkhipov-nuclear-war https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2022/10/27/23426482/cuban... "The end in this case meant not just the fate of the submarine and its crew, but potentially the entire world. Cut off from outside contact, buffeted by depth charges, its air conditioning broken, and temperatures and carbon dioxide levels rising in the sub, the most obvious conclusion for the officers of B-59 was that global war had already begun. But the sub had a weapon at its disposal that US officers didn’t know about: a 10-kiloton nuclear torpedo. And its officers had permission from their superiors to launch it without confirmation from Moscow. Two of the sub’s senior officers wanted to launch the nuclear torpedo. That included its captain, Valentin Savitsky, who according to a report from the US National Security Archive, exclaimed: “We’re gonna blast them now! We will die, but we will sink them all — we will not become the shame of the fleet.”"
- nyolfen 4y ago
  lol, nixon? the guy who withdrew from vietnam? did you mean johnson?
  - moose_man 4y ago
    I talking about the guy who told his aides to tell world leaders he was mentally unstable and might nuke someone for fun. The guy who put staying in office over the health of the country until there was no option for him.
    - nyolfen 4y ago
      yes, if there's one thing richard nixon was known for it was radically disproportionate military response, such as the time he nuked china
  - mc32 4y ago
    While Kennedy had certain patriotism about him and cared for the country despite some questionable stuff (like his dad's business and appointing his brother as AG) he did have some medical conditions which necessitated some significant medications which affected his mood, thinking and judgement. It's no wonder the deep state disliked him so much.
  - mrguyorama 4y ago
    Nixon had many incidents where he got very drunk and would get on the phone to important people and tell them to nuke, like, whoever he felt like at the time.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
yesenadam 4y ago
(I'm not sure that's not a joke.) It seems the credit actually should go to Vasili Arkhipov. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasily_Arkhipov https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasily_Arkhipov

beebmam 4y ago

That's the point of the cold war: management through deterrence, stated retaliatory policies, and diplomacy. Cold wars are GOOD. Cold wars are how you prevent hot wars, and also how you prevent powerful aggressive countries from annexing and colonizing people at will.

moose_man 4y ago
Exactly, deterrence is a guardrail preventing conflict. It's the most important buffer. The last thing you want is for one side to try their luck on an offensive move.

foverzar 4y ago

> When there were incidents like the Cuban missile crisis it was because the ground rules weren't clear to all the players. The Soviets didn't think the US would react the way it did Missiles in Cuba were a USSRs response to US nukes in Turkey, so I am not sure I understand your point.