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Anything that doesn't try to cushion feelings feels problematic in this age. I think we need to go back to the stoics, and forget about all this touchy-feely t

Anything that doesn't try to cushion feelings feels problematic in this age. I think we need to go back to the stoics, and forget about all this touchy-feely that being all soft is ok. Sometimes it's not ok. When did self-discipline become a bad word for so many people?

aschearer 4y ago
Who said self-discipline is bad? Why can't we have self-discipline without shame, guilt, or authoritarianism? We're not children who need parents to force us clean up our rooms. Sure let's be stoic, but I don't agree that means "fuck your feeling" or looks anything like the comic you linked. There's a third way.
- mrleinad 4y ago
  > We're not children who need parents to force us clean up our rooms By parent you mean yourself? Because I don't think you're getting the point that sometimes your mind needs to stop and just do the damn job. And you need to be in charge of it, instead of letting it wander on endlessly.
  - aschearer 4y ago
    Yes, by parent I mean the super ego or whatever metaphor suits you. I believe I understand your point, and agree with you. You're saying "sometimes your mind needs to stop" and that "you need to be in charge of it." E.g. your mind might be very anxious and distracted by an upcoming work deadline and seek to soothe itself by reading Hacker News, but "you" should stop that from happening, say by installing a site-blocking plugin for your browser and instituting and adhering to "work hours" each morning. Assuming I'm not way off target, I agree with all that. But it seems we're talking past each other, as I'm responding to your original comic strip which has more to say. The metaphors it uses, and that you have used in this discussion, depict compulsion. That's where I disagree with you. I believe force / shame / guilt work, but that we should aspire for a superior resolution to the problem. One not based on those principles.
    - mrleinad 4y ago
      > we should aspire for a superior resolution to the problem The superior resolution is that your mind gets trained not to wander off by constant repetition. Your brain will always seek immediate rewards, it's just innate to your monkey brain. You have to train it not to. Same as you train a muscle to grow by having it lift weights even though it would rather not because it's painful. Not sure why you say "shame" or "guilt", those were never part of my initial argument nor the comic. Force, yes, in the same way you force your arms to do push-ups or lift weights.

aschearer 4y ago

Who said self-discipline is bad? Why can't we have self-discipline without shame, guilt, or authoritarianism? We're not children who need parents to force us clean up our rooms. Sure let's be stoic, but I don't agree that means "fuck your feeling" or looks anything like the comic you linked. There's a third way.

mrleinad 4y ago
> We're not children who need parents to force us clean up our rooms By parent you mean yourself? Because I don't think you're getting the point that sometimes your mind needs to stop and just do the damn job. And you need to be in charge of it, instead of letting it wander on endlessly.
- aschearer 4y ago
  Yes, by parent I mean the super ego or whatever metaphor suits you. I believe I understand your point, and agree with you. You're saying "sometimes your mind needs to stop" and that "you need to be in charge of it." E.g. your mind might be very anxious and distracted by an upcoming work deadline and seek to soothe itself by reading Hacker News, but "you" should stop that from happening, say by installing a site-blocking plugin for your browser and instituting and adhering to "work hours" each morning. Assuming I'm not way off target, I agree with all that. But it seems we're talking past each other, as I'm responding to your original comic strip which has more to say. The metaphors it uses, and that you have used in this discussion, depict compulsion. That's where I disagree with you. I believe force / shame / guilt work, but that we should aspire for a superior resolution to the problem. One not based on those principles.
  - mrleinad 4y ago
    > we should aspire for a superior resolution to the problem The superior resolution is that your mind gets trained not to wander off by constant repetition. Your brain will always seek immediate rewards, it's just innate to your monkey brain. You have to train it not to. Same as you train a muscle to grow by having it lift weights even though it would rather not because it's painful. Not sure why you say "shame" or "guilt", those were never part of my initial argument nor the comic. Force, yes, in the same way you force your arms to do push-ups or lift weights.