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21 comments and not one person mentioned steroids. These are extremely common and are an open secret. All of these bodybuilders who share their routines and mea

21 comments and not one person mentioned steroids. These are extremely common and are an open secret. All of these bodybuilders who share their routines and meal plans rarely mention what cycles they are on and the long term health consequences of such after their career has finished.

vsareto 4y ago
Correct. You can also go to a Testosterone replacement clinic and get an actual TRT prescription provided your T is actually low. If they are ethical, they will monitor to keep it within a healthy range so you don't go past an upper limit. Your results will suck ass if you have low T.
- goldfeld 4y ago
  However pump up the T and your hairline will run away from you fast, then your hair will dropset to failure.
  - moneywoes 4y ago
    Isn’t there something you can take to prevent that from happening?
    - jeffreyrogers 4y ago
      Yes, it's not really the testosterone that causes hair loss, it's the DHT the testosterone is converted too and there are drugs and topical foams that can prevent that conversion from happening in the scalp. There are other medications and treatments that work differently as well. It's a complicated topic. Also some people just aren't very susceptible to hair loss.
    - wolongong942 4y ago
      Not really, finasteride with steroids will spike your estrogen (which was already an issue with the extra testosterone) and cause you to get permanent manboobs and other sexual issues IIRC, and if you use yet another drug to block this estrogen conversion it's even more dangerous. Basically you have the male pattern baldness gene stay away from roids. If you need more motivation, study after study show women are less attracted to bodybuilder physiques anyway.
dr_petes 4y ago
Steroids are illegal in most countries. You don’t win an award by sharing your illegal hobby in the open. For perspective, if a top pro shared their exact stack, there would be tons of teenagers who have never lifted do the exact stack. Which, as you mention, would have negative long therm consequences.
- erybodyknows 4y ago
  I disagree. As it is now, they will strive to achieve a result that is forever unattainable without performance enhancing drugs. In my opinion, this is like people who make millions selling their how to make millions courses.
- kortex 4y ago
  Yes, steroids are technically illegal, but they are typically Sch 4, and are just about the "softest" kind of illegal. As in, it's pretty trivial to find vendor willing to ship you a kilo of "cellulose" or other paper-thin cover for white powder that will easily skate through customs. There's near zero enforcement for steroids, so yes it does end up as an open secret.
ashconnor 4y ago
More people using steroids than not if YouTube or Instagram is any barometer. This obviously leads to very unrealistic expectations for those that are natural. The nattyorjuice subreddit is sobering material.
bnralt 4y ago
It’s an issue - a lot of people just want to be decently fit, so they look online for advice. But the people populating forums and putting up blogs are usually bodybuilder types who that are on steroids and have been lifting since they were teenagers. There seems to be a lot of body dysmorphia in the community as well (“The day you start lifting is the day you become forever small”). The needs and goals of these two groups of people are going to be so drastically different that a lot of the advice is going to end up being counterproductive.
dav_Oz 4y ago
Imhv the bodybuilding/powerlifting community is pretty open about it once you immerse yourself there. But, yeah, the non-initiated get a pretty skewed picture about how muscular one can get, naturally. That's a whole another discussion about body perception/dismorphia and societal idealizations. It is also fairly easy to give an accurate estimation (esp. if fat percentage <10%) via FFMI.[0] In some natural bodybuilding competitions anyone with FFMI >25 is ruled out automatically because of the high probability of steroid use at that point. Of course a non-trivial amount of natural genetic freaks certainly exist beyond this number and a case can be made that's the whole point of competitive sports: "freaks" competing against each other. But then again once you are in the highly competitive game it is (nearly) impossible to resist PEDs. I guess for that reason many different classes/federations exist to choose from. [0]https://mennohenselmans.com/ffmi-calculator/ https://mennohenselmans.com/ffmi-calculator/

vsareto 4y ago

Correct. You can also go to a Testosterone replacement clinic and get an actual TRT prescription provided your T is actually low. If they are ethical, they will monitor to keep it within a healthy range so you don't go past an upper limit. Your results will suck ass if you have low T.

goldfeld 4y ago
However pump up the T and your hairline will run away from you fast, then your hair will dropset to failure.
- moneywoes 4y ago
  Isn’t there something you can take to prevent that from happening?
  - jeffreyrogers 4y ago
    Yes, it's not really the testosterone that causes hair loss, it's the DHT the testosterone is converted too and there are drugs and topical foams that can prevent that conversion from happening in the scalp. There are other medications and treatments that work differently as well. It's a complicated topic. Also some people just aren't very susceptible to hair loss.
  - wolongong942 4y ago
    Not really, finasteride with steroids will spike your estrogen (which was already an issue with the extra testosterone) and cause you to get permanent manboobs and other sexual issues IIRC, and if you use yet another drug to block this estrogen conversion it's even more dangerous. Basically you have the male pattern baldness gene stay away from roids. If you need more motivation, study after study show women are less attracted to bodybuilder physiques anyway.

dr_petes 4y ago

Steroids are illegal in most countries. You don’t win an award by sharing your illegal hobby in the open. For perspective, if a top pro shared their exact stack, there would be tons of teenagers who have never lifted do the exact stack. Which, as you mention, would have negative long therm consequences.

erybodyknows 4y ago
I disagree. As it is now, they will strive to achieve a result that is forever unattainable without performance enhancing drugs. In my opinion, this is like people who make millions selling their how to make millions courses.
kortex 4y ago
Yes, steroids are technically illegal, but they are typically Sch 4, and are just about the "softest" kind of illegal. As in, it's pretty trivial to find vendor willing to ship you a kilo of "cellulose" or other paper-thin cover for white powder that will easily skate through customs. There's near zero enforcement for steroids, so yes it does end up as an open secret.

ashconnor 4y ago

More people using steroids than not if YouTube or Instagram is any barometer. This obviously leads to very unrealistic expectations for those that are natural. The nattyorjuice subreddit is sobering material.

bnralt 4y ago

It’s an issue - a lot of people just want to be decently fit, so they look online for advice. But the people populating forums and putting up blogs are usually bodybuilder types who that are on steroids and have been lifting since they were teenagers. There seems to be a lot of body dysmorphia in the community as well (“The day you start lifting is the day you become forever small”). The needs and goals of these two groups of people are going to be so drastically different that a lot of the advice is going to end up being counterproductive.

dav_Oz 4y ago

Imhv the bodybuilding/powerlifting community is pretty open about it once you immerse yourself there. But, yeah, the non-initiated get a pretty skewed picture about how muscular one can get, naturally. That's a whole another discussion about body perception/dismorphia and societal idealizations. It is also fairly easy to give an accurate estimation (esp. if fat percentage <10%) via FFMI.[0] In some natural bodybuilding competitions anyone with FFMI >25 is ruled out automatically because of the high probability of steroid use at that point. Of course a non-trivial amount of natural genetic freaks certainly exist beyond this number and a case can be made that's the whole point of competitive sports: "freaks" competing against each other. But then again once you are in the highly competitive game it is (nearly) impossible to resist PEDs. I guess for that reason many different classes/federations exist to choose from. [0]https://mennohenselmans.com/ffmi-calculator/ https://mennohenselmans.com/ffmi-calculator/