6 ms·

OpenTTD is succesful not just because of the game itself good but it’s a truly free clone of the original. You don’t need the original game files, there are are

OpenTTD is succesful not just because of the game itself good but it’s a truly free clone of the original. You don’t need the original game files, there are are replacements for the graphics, sound, and music. imo that’s the “problem” with most of the open source game clones. They are just the barebones engine where you need the original files. Which of course doesn’t sound like a big ask especially if it’s an older game but still additional extra steps that makes the users job harder. And also makes the official distribution of the game impossible. See how OpenTTD is available in one package on Steam [0] 0, https://store.steampowered.com/app/1536610/OpenTTD/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/1536610/OpenTTD/

LarryMullins 4y ago
OpenRCT2 seems to be doing pretty well regardless. I don't know how the player counts compare, but the OpenRCT2 community seems very active and the engine seems to have a good deal of care and polish put into it. They upgraded the file format a while ago, greatly expanding the capabilities of the game (increased ride limit, etc)
rebolek 4y ago
That's because it's a very mature clone. In the early versions, you of course needed original game files. And let's be honest, TTD with user gfx would still be TTD but something like Morrowind with user scenarios would be a different game.
- derefr 4y ago
  > TTD with user gfx would still be TTD but something like Morrowind with user scenarios would be a different game. Isn't that an apples-to-oranges comparison? Both games have graphics; you could substitute user graphics with the same semiotics, for the same objects into Morrowind, while retaining the same game feel, just like they did in OpenTTD. Morrowind does additionally have scripted scenario dialogue and descriptive text. But you're picturing the wrong thing if you're picturing a need to substitute entirely custom scenarios. Instead, picture "paraphrasing to avoid copyright." Plagiarism isn't illegal; only literally republishing the text of another copyrighted work is. A hypothetical open-source Morrowind project could convey the same scenario with merely different prose — the same as they could convery the same object assets with merely different artistic direction.
  - Macha 4y ago
    > Both games have graphics; you could substitute user graphics with the same semiotics, for the same objects into Morrowind, while retaining the same game feel, just like they did in OpenTTD. And not only this, there are various graphical user mods to do just that, which someone bundles up into a modpack every few years
anthk 4y ago
That's not an OSS game clone, but a game engine reimplementation. Clones would be Bombermaan, Secret Maryo Chronicles, Freeciv, Pangzero...
arp242 4y ago
I don't think that requiring the original game files is a huge hurdle, unless the game is very esoteric and hard to find. There are many widely-used game engines that require the game files, such as ScummVM, Rollercoaster tycoon, etc. The problem is more that many of the open source game engines aren't complete: features are missing, bugs not present in the original, etc. These sort of projects tend to be pretty large and also fairly binary: either it's complete, useful, and playable, or it's not (yet) complete and it's unplayable and useless. There's a bit of grey area, but a lot less than many other projects. You can get away with "small implementation of X which slowly accrues features over time" with many projects, but a lot less so with reimplementation of games.
- anthk 4y ago
  Eh, you are getting in wrong. There are lots of complete game engine reimplementations with most of the bugs fixed. They run far better than the original game engine on any new OS. If any, it's good to have working WIP projects and reimplementations for games such as Resident Evil so they don't require emulation any more and thus they could run fast as hell on an Atom netbook.
  - arp242 4y ago
    > There are lots of complete game engine reimplementations with most of the bugs fixed. They run far better than the original game engine on any new OS. I never said that's not the case.
- dark-star 4y ago
  > These sort of projects tend to be pretty large and also fairly binary: either it's complete, useful, and playable, or it's not (yet) complete and it's unplayable and useless. Everything is "binary" if you choose an arbitrary cutoff point. Your example of ScummVM is a bad one: in ScummVM there are games that show nothing but a title screen, games where about half of the game works, games that are completeable but are lacking some aspect (e.g. music/sound effects/animations), games that are perfectly playable and completeable, and even games that have improvements upon the original games. The whole spectrum is present in ScummVM's engines at almost any point in time, as there are new engines constantly being added and others perfected. A game that's completeable but lacks music, for example, is certainly not "useless". The fact that many of these engines are not (yet) complete is certainly not exclusive to game reimplementations. There's hardly any open-source project or game that declares itself "complete"
lloeki 4y ago
As a fascinatingly rare case, OpenRA has the actual original assets a very convenient download away ("License and Game Assets" text[0]) right in the UI when you start it, thanks to an interesting license twist I did not know about[1]. (IIIRC minus the music and cutscenes, which you can import from the original games) > The OpenRA game engine is free software released under the GPL3 license. The OpenRA mods require files from the original games, which are used under the license granted by the C&C Franchise Modding Guidelines. These files are not covered by the OpenRA license, and you will be prompted to download or copy them the first time you run a mod. > EA has not endorsed and does not support this product. [0]: https://www.openra.net/download/ https://www.openra.net/download/ [1]: https://www.ea.com/games/command-and-conquer/command-and-conquer-remastered/modding-faq?isLocalized=true https://www.ea.com/games/command-and-conquer/command-and-con...

LarryMullins 4y ago

OpenRCT2 seems to be doing pretty well regardless. I don't know how the player counts compare, but the OpenRCT2 community seems very active and the engine seems to have a good deal of care and polish put into it. They upgraded the file format a while ago, greatly expanding the capabilities of the game (increased ride limit, etc)

rebolek 4y ago

That's because it's a very mature clone. In the early versions, you of course needed original game files. And let's be honest, TTD with user gfx would still be TTD but something like Morrowind with user scenarios would be a different game.

derefr 4y ago
> TTD with user gfx would still be TTD but something like Morrowind with user scenarios would be a different game. Isn't that an apples-to-oranges comparison? Both games have graphics; you could substitute user graphics with the same semiotics, for the same objects into Morrowind, while retaining the same game feel, just like they did in OpenTTD. Morrowind does additionally have scripted scenario dialogue and descriptive text. But you're picturing the wrong thing if you're picturing a need to substitute entirely custom scenarios. Instead, picture "paraphrasing to avoid copyright." Plagiarism isn't illegal; only literally republishing the text of another copyrighted work is. A hypothetical open-source Morrowind project could convey the same scenario with merely different prose — the same as they could convery the same object assets with merely different artistic direction.
- Macha 4y ago
  > Both games have graphics; you could substitute user graphics with the same semiotics, for the same objects into Morrowind, while retaining the same game feel, just like they did in OpenTTD. And not only this, there are various graphical user mods to do just that, which someone bundles up into a modpack every few years

anthk 4y ago

That's not an OSS game clone, but a game engine reimplementation. Clones would be Bombermaan, Secret Maryo Chronicles, Freeciv, Pangzero...

arp242 4y ago

I don't think that requiring the original game files is a huge hurdle, unless the game is very esoteric and hard to find. There are many widely-used game engines that require the game files, such as ScummVM, Rollercoaster tycoon, etc. The problem is more that many of the open source game engines aren't complete: features are missing, bugs not present in the original, etc. These sort of projects tend to be pretty large and also fairly binary: either it's complete, useful, and playable, or it's not (yet) complete and it's unplayable and useless. There's a bit of grey area, but a lot less than many other projects. You can get away with "small implementation of X which slowly accrues features over time" with many projects, but a lot less so with reimplementation of games.

anthk 4y ago
Eh, you are getting in wrong. There are lots of complete game engine reimplementations with most of the bugs fixed. They run far better than the original game engine on any new OS. If any, it's good to have working WIP projects and reimplementations for games such as Resident Evil so they don't require emulation any more and thus they could run fast as hell on an Atom netbook.
- arp242 4y ago
  > There are lots of complete game engine reimplementations with most of the bugs fixed. They run far better than the original game engine on any new OS. I never said that's not the case.
dark-star 4y ago
> These sort of projects tend to be pretty large and also fairly binary: either it's complete, useful, and playable, or it's not (yet) complete and it's unplayable and useless. Everything is "binary" if you choose an arbitrary cutoff point. Your example of ScummVM is a bad one: in ScummVM there are games that show nothing but a title screen, games where about half of the game works, games that are completeable but are lacking some aspect (e.g. music/sound effects/animations), games that are perfectly playable and completeable, and even games that have improvements upon the original games. The whole spectrum is present in ScummVM's engines at almost any point in time, as there are new engines constantly being added and others perfected. A game that's completeable but lacks music, for example, is certainly not "useless". The fact that many of these engines are not (yet) complete is certainly not exclusive to game reimplementations. There's hardly any open-source project or game that declares itself "complete"

lloeki 4y ago

As a fascinatingly rare case, OpenRA has the actual original assets a very convenient download away ("License and Game Assets" text[0]) right in the UI when you start it, thanks to an interesting license twist I did not know about[1]. (IIIRC minus the music and cutscenes, which you can import from the original games) > The OpenRA game engine is free software released under the GPL3 license. The OpenRA mods require files from the original games, which are used under the license granted by the C&C Franchise Modding Guidelines. These files are not covered by the OpenRA license, and you will be prompted to download or copy them the first time you run a mod. > EA has not endorsed and does not support this product. [0]: https://www.openra.net/download/ https://www.openra.net/download/ [1]: https://www.ea.com/games/command-and-conquer/command-and-conquer-remastered/modding-faq?isLocalized=true https://www.ea.com/games/command-and-conquer/command-and-con...