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No, it was almost a hit, but it was in fact a miss; and it was not a distant miss, so it was a near miss. There are plenty of phrases in English that make no s

No, it was almost a hit, but it was in fact a miss; and it was not a distant miss, so it was a near miss. There are plenty of phrases in English that make no sense compositionally, but "near miss" is not one of them.

brandonagr2 4y ago
https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/98951-here-s-a-phrase-that-apparently-the-airlines-simply-made-up https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/98951-here-s-a-phrase-that-... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDKdvTecYAM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDKdvTecYAM
idbehold 4y ago
Near | Adverb 1. Close by 2. Almost So both interpretations are correct. This reminds me of a comic strip (I think) where they're training someone working at a nuclear reactor and the instructor says, "Just remember: you can never have too much water in a nuclear reactor." The phrase can be interpreted to mean two very different things.
- ec109685 4y ago
  I had to Google for the other interpretation of that: https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/282388/interpretation-of-ambiguous-sentence-you-can-t-put-too-much-water-into-a-nuclea https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/282388/interpret...
- bscphil 4y ago
  From a quick search it looks like it was S10E06 of Saturday Night Live. The skit is at 53:45. https://archive.org/details/saturday-night-live-s-10-e-06-ed-asner-the-kinks https://archive.org/details/saturday-night-live-s-10-e-06-ed...
- blahedo 4y ago
  And "miss" is a noun in this phrase, so the adverb usage of "near" (which I am, um, aware of, thanks) is not especially relevant to this analysis.
- Vecr 4y ago
  Actually I think you can have too much water in some reactors, it's called "going solid".
ars 4y ago
Near miss can also mean they almost missed, but didn't. Change "near" to "almost" and see how it sounds to you: Two planes "almost hit" vs "almost missed".
- blahedo 4y ago
  If I change both words of the phrase ("near" to "almost" and "miss" to "missed"), also changing both parts of speech and the overall phrase type in the process, that does shift its meaning, yes. I'm familiar with the claim that "near hit" ought to make more sense (and with the Carlin sketch that either originated or popularised it). But in practice, people use the phrase "near miss", not "near hit" (unless actively making the George Carlin joke), and they don't use "near miss" to mean what you claim ("almost missed, but didn't" i.e. hit). So this, again, isn't really a claim about what the phrase can mean, but about what you'd logically want it to mean. Such claims are a bit counterproductive at the best of times—language doesn't always follow compositional logic, and sometimes we just have to live with that—but here it's especially odd because the phrase means exactly what the component words say it does: a "near miss" (noun phrase) is a miss (noun) that is near (adjective).
- thaumasiotes 4y ago
  > Near miss can also mean they almost missed, but didn't. I strongly suspect that isn't true. Can you link to an example of someone using it that way?
kristjansson 4y ago
Not that English is a sensible language, but I think "near miss" makes sense if one looks at where 'near' as acting as an adverb vs an adjective 1. near (adj) miss (n) - it was a miss, but a near one (i.e. a close miss) 2. nearly (adv) hit (v) - they almost collided, but didn't 3. nearly (adv) missed (v) - they collided, but it was almost avoidable (the Carlin joke "oh, they nearly missed ...) 4. was nearly (adv to was) a hit, that nearly (adv) hit (v) us, ... 5. near (adj) hit (n) - doesn't really make sense, should be 2 or 4.

brandonagr2 4y ago

https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/98951-here-s-a-phrase-that-apparently-the-airlines-simply-made-up https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/98951-here-s-a-phrase-that-... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDKdvTecYAM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDKdvTecYAM

idbehold 4y ago

Near | Adverb 1. Close by 2. Almost So both interpretations are correct. This reminds me of a comic strip (I think) where they're training someone working at a nuclear reactor and the instructor says, "Just remember: you can never have too much water in a nuclear reactor." The phrase can be interpreted to mean two very different things.

ec109685 4y ago
I had to Google for the other interpretation of that: https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/282388/interpretation-of-ambiguous-sentence-you-can-t-put-too-much-water-into-a-nuclea https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/282388/interpret...
bscphil 4y ago
From a quick search it looks like it was S10E06 of Saturday Night Live. The skit is at 53:45. https://archive.org/details/saturday-night-live-s-10-e-06-ed-asner-the-kinks https://archive.org/details/saturday-night-live-s-10-e-06-ed...
blahedo 4y ago
And "miss" is a noun in this phrase, so the adverb usage of "near" (which I am, um, aware of, thanks) is not especially relevant to this analysis.
Vecr 4y ago
Actually I think you can have too much water in some reactors, it's called "going solid".

ars 4y ago

Near miss can also mean they almost missed, but didn't. Change "near" to "almost" and see how it sounds to you: Two planes "almost hit" vs "almost missed".

blahedo 4y ago
If I change both words of the phrase ("near" to "almost" and "miss" to "missed"), also changing both parts of speech and the overall phrase type in the process, that does shift its meaning, yes. I'm familiar with the claim that "near hit" ought to make more sense (and with the Carlin sketch that either originated or popularised it). But in practice, people use the phrase "near miss", not "near hit" (unless actively making the George Carlin joke), and they don't use "near miss" to mean what you claim ("almost missed, but didn't" i.e. hit). So this, again, isn't really a claim about what the phrase can mean, but about what you'd logically want it to mean. Such claims are a bit counterproductive at the best of times—language doesn't always follow compositional logic, and sometimes we just have to live with that—but here it's especially odd because the phrase means exactly what the component words say it does: a "near miss" (noun phrase) is a miss (noun) that is near (adjective).
thaumasiotes 4y ago
> Near miss can also mean they almost missed, but didn't. I strongly suspect that isn't true. Can you link to an example of someone using it that way?

kristjansson 4y ago

Not that English is a sensible language, but I think "near miss" makes sense if one looks at where 'near' as acting as an adverb vs an adjective 1. near (adj) miss (n) - it was a miss, but a near one (i.e. a close miss) 2. nearly (adv) hit (v) - they almost collided, but didn't 3. nearly (adv) missed (v) - they collided, but it was almost avoidable (the Carlin joke "oh, they nearly missed ...) 4. was nearly (adv to was) a hit, that nearly (adv) hit (v) us, ... 5. near (adj) hit (n) - doesn't really make sense, should be 2 or 4.