8 ms·

That's a good sign that they're not good relationship material - the earlier this happens, the sooner you can get out. Either way, it works out.

rayiner 4y ago
[flagged]
- beebeepka 4y ago
  You honestly think the majority of women would be disgusted to find out their men have human feelings? This seems ridiculous to me, but not impossible. Maybe women are different outside Europe and South America. What do I know how things work where you are.
- jmckib 4y ago
  I know we are all speaking from our own experience here, but I’ve never even heard of a woman being disgusted by or leaving a man because he cried. I’ve cried in front of every long term girlfriend I’ve ever had and it’s never been a negative, only positive. Could it be a cultural thing? I’m American and I’ve always lived in major coastal cities.
  - Our_Benefactors 4y ago
    > I’ve cried in front of every long term girlfriend I’ve ever had and it’s never been a negative, only positive. They’re your exes… how can you be so confident that it was positive for the relationship?
    - jmckib 4y ago
      Because of their reactions and also because we stayed together many years afterwards, not to mention I’m currently married to the most recent one!
  - rayiner 4y ago
    > Could it be a cultural thing? I’m American and I’ve always lived in major coastal cities. Possibly—I’m from a Muslim country. I’ve seen my dad cry twice, once when our dog died and once when his mom died. He had a good relationship with his own dad but didn’t cry when he died. My mom would probably freak out if he expressed more weakness than that. But to my point, Americans in major coastal cities are a minority in terms of culture. And I assume you are white. Even in major coastal cities, non-whites typically have more traditional expectations about male behavior.
- loeg 4y ago
  I think you're vastly overstating the percentage of women who would leave someone for crying.
  - rayiner 4y ago
    Traditional norms obviously allow men to cry in certain circumstances. I don’t take OP to be referring to that. I read OP as saying that most women wouldn’t want to be with a man who consistently departs from the traditional expectations of when it’s okay for men to cry. Which I think is probably true.
- seba_dos1 4y ago
  Your assumption about that "large fraction" may hold when talking about 15 year old girls maybe, but is unlikely to be true in general.
- tptacek 4y ago
  What a weird thing to say. Can you go into some detail about where you derived the "large fraction" from? Is it something you read somewhere?
  - rayiner 4y ago
    You might disagree with it, but I don’t think it’s “weird.” Men showing emotional weakness or vulnerability is certainly not acceptable in my culture, and as far as I can tell it’s not broadly accepted in American culture either. The only inference I’m drawing is that women embrace the cultural taboo as much as men, which I think is a reasonable assumption—women are typically the strongest keepers and enforcers of culture and norms.
    - tptacek 4y ago
      Can you tell me more about how you developed your intuition that it's not broadly accepted in our shared American culture? I think there's a lot of countervailing evidence (teaser: it's an MMA cliche) suggesting that this is not at all a taboo, but I don't understand well enough where you've gotten this notion.
      - rayiner 4y ago
        My reference points for American culture are white southerners (where men crying is taboo) and elite whites in metro areas (who complain about “toxic masculinity” and its taboos on men crying). Those two groups disagree whether the taboo is a good thing, but both agree that it characterizes American culture. Since that’s also consistent with norms in my own culture, I have no reason to doubt those assertions.
        tptacek 4y ago
        Well, let's interrogate that. I think you've got a bum read. Start here: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/ManlyTears/Sports https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/ManlyTears/Sports

rayiner 4y ago

[flagged]

beebeepka 4y ago
You honestly think the majority of women would be disgusted to find out their men have human feelings? This seems ridiculous to me, but not impossible. Maybe women are different outside Europe and South America. What do I know how things work where you are.
jmckib 4y ago
I know we are all speaking from our own experience here, but I’ve never even heard of a woman being disgusted by or leaving a man because he cried. I’ve cried in front of every long term girlfriend I’ve ever had and it’s never been a negative, only positive. Could it be a cultural thing? I’m American and I’ve always lived in major coastal cities.
- Our_Benefactors 4y ago
  > I’ve cried in front of every long term girlfriend I’ve ever had and it’s never been a negative, only positive. They’re your exes… how can you be so confident that it was positive for the relationship?
  - jmckib 4y ago
    Because of their reactions and also because we stayed together many years afterwards, not to mention I’m currently married to the most recent one!
- rayiner 4y ago
  > Could it be a cultural thing? I’m American and I’ve always lived in major coastal cities. Possibly—I’m from a Muslim country. I’ve seen my dad cry twice, once when our dog died and once when his mom died. He had a good relationship with his own dad but didn’t cry when he died. My mom would probably freak out if he expressed more weakness than that. But to my point, Americans in major coastal cities are a minority in terms of culture. And I assume you are white. Even in major coastal cities, non-whites typically have more traditional expectations about male behavior.
loeg 4y ago
I think you're vastly overstating the percentage of women who would leave someone for crying.
- rayiner 4y ago
  Traditional norms obviously allow men to cry in certain circumstances. I don’t take OP to be referring to that. I read OP as saying that most women wouldn’t want to be with a man who consistently departs from the traditional expectations of when it’s okay for men to cry. Which I think is probably true.
seba_dos1 4y ago
Your assumption about that "large fraction" may hold when talking about 15 year old girls maybe, but is unlikely to be true in general.
tptacek 4y ago
What a weird thing to say. Can you go into some detail about where you derived the "large fraction" from? Is it something you read somewhere?
- rayiner 4y ago
  You might disagree with it, but I don’t think it’s “weird.” Men showing emotional weakness or vulnerability is certainly not acceptable in my culture, and as far as I can tell it’s not broadly accepted in American culture either. The only inference I’m drawing is that women embrace the cultural taboo as much as men, which I think is a reasonable assumption—women are typically the strongest keepers and enforcers of culture and norms.
  - tptacek 4y ago
    Can you tell me more about how you developed your intuition that it's not broadly accepted in our shared American culture? I think there's a lot of countervailing evidence (teaser: it's an MMA cliche) suggesting that this is not at all a taboo, but I don't understand well enough where you've gotten this notion.
    - rayiner 4y ago
      My reference points for American culture are white southerners (where men crying is taboo) and elite whites in metro areas (who complain about “toxic masculinity” and its taboos on men crying). Those two groups disagree whether the taboo is a good thing, but both agree that it characterizes American culture. Since that’s also consistent with norms in my own culture, I have no reason to doubt those assertions.
      - tptacek 4y ago
        Well, let's interrogate that. I think you've got a bum read. Start here: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/ManlyTears/Sports https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/ManlyTears/Sports