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There are intelligent and well informed materialist philosophers who understand this debate well, but are still materialist. Even though I agree with the autho
by Winsaucerer 4y ago
There are intelligent and well informed materialist philosophers who understand this debate well, but are still materialist. Even though I agree with the author that some kind of idealism is our best view (in virtue of its breadth and simplicity), the rude dismissal is unwarranted.
With that said, I'd like to reply further, becacuse I think you may be mixing up what we call hard problems of consciousness with easy problems of consciousness. Easy problems relate to things like correlations between the mental and the physical. The hard problems relate to things like how we would explain consciousness at all given, say, the tools the materialist has available. Your reply seems to muster evidence that relates to the easy problems but not the hard. I do not know of any kind of possible experiment researchers could be working on to address the hard problem.
I assume the author did not define consciousness because the problem they refer to is well known and discussed. When we talk about consciousness with respect to the mind/body problem, we're talking about the fact that there is an inner phenomenology, or a what-it's-like to be us. This kind of consciousness can be present while asleep, because it's not about the being awake and being aware, but rather the fact there is something that it's like to be you.
With that in mind, the examples you refer to with optical illusions, the man who mistook his wife as a hat, and so on, are all irrelevant to the hard question. There is absolutely no doubt that changes in the physical world can result in changes in the mental, including optical illusions -- the materialist, the dualist, and the idealist all agree on this point, and such examples will not settle the hard question. Our experiences are shaped, enormously, perhaps even as much as wholly, by our brain states. This is all part of the work of the easy problems of consciousness. None of that means or entails or suggests that the mental is an emergent property of the material, or that the material comes first.
An idealist of the sort I am will say something like this: God has in mind an idea of a physical world, and based on God's idea of that world (which includes God's idea of our brain) impresses upon other minds an experience of, say, a tree with leaves blowing in the wind. If my brain is wired differently, then I will have different experiences impressed upon me by God because of that than what others might experience. Perhaps the leaves of the tree will look a different colour to me than they do to others, all because of facts about my brain states (which themselves reduce to facts about an idea in God's mind).
The materialist has no way -- not even the vaguest hint of a way -- to explain the mental, the phenomenology of our consciousness. There is no explanation that can be given that says how we can go from the physical to the mental. The best that can be done are things like: deny the existence of any phenomenology/inner experiences altogether so that there's nothing to explain (or similarly -- literally identify brain states mental states and say they are the same thing), embrace some kind of non-reductive physicalism (which in my opinion amounts to a form of dualism), or hope that some clever person will come up with a better explanation one day.
Idealist views do not suffer from an an analogous "hard problem of non-consciousness". The idealist can give an explanation for the physical on their view, but the physicalist cannot give an explanation of the mental.
- layer8 4y agoThere is the view that the so-called hard problem is actually the easy one, while the so-called easy prpblem is actually quite hard. That is, there is nothing mysterious/magical that needs explaining(the “hard” problem), but getting a grasp on how the physical correlates relate to the internal experience (the “easy” problem) is actually really hard. My personal realization was that whatever we experience as our consciousness is necessarily a perception, including “what it feels like” to be a conscious being, or what is being referred to as qualia. If you didn’t perceive it, you wouldn’t be aware of it. So there’s nothing we talk about here that is not a perception. And, while being a quite complex perception in content and structure, it is certainly representable in our brain, including the self-referential loop that lets us have an experience of our experience. This insight came by practicing meditation for a while, where after some time you realize that there’s really nothing there but what you perceive. Your thoughts and feelings are just something you perceive. Your feeling of self is just something you perceive. The texture of all the various experiences you have is just something you perceive. The realization of having a realization is just something you perceive. The feeling of perceiving any of those things is itself just something you perceive. And perception just means input. As far as I’m concerned, that’s all there is to the “hard” problem.
- schoen 4y agoDoes that suggest that computer software that can refer to itself (quines, reflection, ...) is also conscious? Like Python programs that do things with their own bytecode (and have a symbolic means of referring to or accessing that code): def self_ref(): print(self_ref.__code__.co_code) or def self_disassemble(): import dis print(dis.dis(self_disassemble.__code__.co_code))
- Winsaucerer 4y agoIf your conclusion is that this is all explicable on physicalism, then I don't agree, because these perceptions exist and should have an explanation, yet are inexplicable given physicalism. I'm not really sure how to go from what you said to the conclusion that this is all there is to the hard problem. With that being said, if I understand you right, I think your meditative insight was a good one. That even things like thoughts and feelings (including things like the realization itself!) are themselves perceptions or phenomenology. Again -- if I understand you right -- I think that is a powerful realization. It sounds almost like your own view is on a path towards an idealist one. I also agree that this level and structure of complexity is representable by our brain. Even though I think brains ultimately reduce to facts about the idea of a physical world in God's mind, I think the perceptions we have (including experiences like realizations) are because of the brains we have (and perhaps other facts about the world). I'm afraid what I'm saying may not make much sense, given the short space I have to say it.