4 ms·

What is a software engineer?

by notyourwork 4y ago

brian_herman 4y ago
Software engineers design and develop computer programs and applications.
- TedDoesntTalk 4y ago
  I thought that’s a software developer?
- gongle 4y ago
  So a programmer
  - rhtgrg 4y ago
    I'd say a programmer is to a software engineer as a handyman is to an architect. Can a handyman do the "dirty work" of most projects? Sure. Can they design a skyscraper to spec, tell you exactly what to expect in terms of resources and timeline, and roll with the punches of logistics and competing priorities? Probably not, unless they were already an architect just doing the job of a handyman. That being said, as someone with a software engineering degree, I can safely say that most companies don't need engineers and can get by just fine with programmers. Anyway, in this industry there are many architects working as handymen and vice versa.
    - LarryMullins 4y ago
      I'd rather be called a handyman than a "Generalist Labor Engineer"
    - PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
      Can an architect actually put the pieces together? Do they know where to source materials? Do they understand how to order and schedule the construction of a design? Do they "just get" why a particular combination of materials at a specific point in a structure is going to cause problems, because they've seen it over and over? Can they even operate all the tools? Probably not, unless they used to actually do construction before becoming an architect.
      - pedrosorio 4y ago
        The answer to most of your questions is yes, although obviously most architects are not proficient in operating most tools used in construction because that's not their job. > Can an architect actually put the pieces together? Unclear what this means, but architects have plenty of training in doing "manual work". Building models requires a lot more precision than most things in construction. > Do they know where to source materials? That's part of their job description. > Do they understand how to order and schedule the construction of a design? Definitely part of their job description.
        PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
        The real truth of the matter is "it depends". I have about a half-dozen friends as architects in the US, and only 1 of them could do any of the things I mentioned. All have been practising residential and commercial and government architects for > 30 years.
- ebjaas_2022 4y ago
  It's a person who applies engineering principles to the design and implementation of software. It's about the "rigidity" of the methods that are used to construct the software. If the software is just cobbled together, it's not "engineered".
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
StevePerkins 4y ago
There is no such thing as a "software engineer", period. An "engineer" is someone who works in a technical profession with a governing body. Either the State, or an entity that might as well be the State. An engineer is certified by that governing body, and given a license to practice the profession. An engineer can have their license suspended or rescinded, in the event of professional misconduct or malpractice. Whether through law, or de facto through insurance company practices, employers face liability if they employ non-licensed engineers. So an engineer is someone who has the leverage to push back against employer pressure to commit malpractice. Computer programmers / software developers have none of these things. Certifications are a joke, and meaningless beyond the entry level. We are pressured by employers to commit malpractice on a near-daily basis, and call it "tech debt" (management at my current company is pushing the even more euphemistic term "tech improvement opportunities"). Without a governing body and licensing, it is impossible for us to be "engineers" in any real sense of the professional term. With respect to Margaret Hamilton, we can only try to emulate an engineering profession as best we can, by evangelizing professional standards and pushing back on malpractice pressure where we can.
- 908B64B197 4y ago
  > There is no such thing as a "software engineer", period. That's a bold statement. Would you argue, for instance, that someone graduating from MIT EECS[0] or Stanford Engineering[1] isn't qualified to use the tittle of Engineer? > An engineer is certified by that governing body, and given a license to practice the profession. An engineer can have their license suspended or rescinded, in the event of professional misconduct or malpractice. I think you are confused with the PE regulations. [2] [0] https://www.eecs.mit.edu/ https://www.eecs.mit.edu/ [1] https://engineering.stanford.edu/students-academics/academics/undergraduate-degree-programs https://engineering.stanford.edu/students-academics/academic... [2] https://ncees.org/about/ https://ncees.org/about/
  - StevePerkins 4y ago
    Has a governing body issued you a license, without which one cannot practice your profession? No? Then indeed, you are not an "engineer" in the sense of a profession, as with doctors and lawyers and CPA's, etc. This is wholly orthogonal to the prestige of whichever college you graduated. Note that even on your own Stanford and MIT links above, they reserve the term "engineering" for programs OTHER THAN "Computer Science" (e.g. "Chemical Engineering", "Electrical Engineering", etc). Show me a "Software Engineering" program at any accredited university. There's no confusion, I am 100% talking about PE regulations. One requires a license to practice chemical engineering, electrical engineering, mechanical engineering, all but the most entry-level roles in aerospace engineering, etc. Employers effectively cannot hire non-licensed workers for those positions. If that does not apply to your job, then you are an "engineer" only in the sense of LinkedIn puffery. Mind you, this applies to all us (myself included) in the software development field. I'm not trying to be a gatekeeper. Rather, the complete absence of gatekeeping is the entire point here.

What is a software engineer?

brian_herman 4y ago

Software engineers design and develop computer programs and applications.

TedDoesntTalk 4y ago
I thought that’s a software developer?
gongle 4y ago
So a programmer
- rhtgrg 4y ago
  I'd say a programmer is to a software engineer as a handyman is to an architect. Can a handyman do the "dirty work" of most projects? Sure. Can they design a skyscraper to spec, tell you exactly what to expect in terms of resources and timeline, and roll with the punches of logistics and competing priorities? Probably not, unless they were already an architect just doing the job of a handyman. That being said, as someone with a software engineering degree, I can safely say that most companies don't need engineers and can get by just fine with programmers. Anyway, in this industry there are many architects working as handymen and vice versa.
  - LarryMullins 4y ago
    I'd rather be called a handyman than a "Generalist Labor Engineer"
  - PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
    Can an architect actually put the pieces together? Do they know where to source materials? Do they understand how to order and schedule the construction of a design? Do they "just get" why a particular combination of materials at a specific point in a structure is going to cause problems, because they've seen it over and over? Can they even operate all the tools? Probably not, unless they used to actually do construction before becoming an architect.
    - pedrosorio 4y ago
      The answer to most of your questions is yes, although obviously most architects are not proficient in operating most tools used in construction because that's not their job. > Can an architect actually put the pieces together? Unclear what this means, but architects have plenty of training in doing "manual work". Building models requires a lot more precision than most things in construction. > Do they know where to source materials? That's part of their job description. > Do they understand how to order and schedule the construction of a design? Definitely part of their job description.
      - PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
        The real truth of the matter is "it depends". I have about a half-dozen friends as architects in the US, and only 1 of them could do any of the things I mentioned. All have been practising residential and commercial and government architects for > 30 years.
ebjaas_2022 4y ago
It's a person who applies engineering principles to the design and implementation of software. It's about the "rigidity" of the methods that are used to construct the software. If the software is just cobbled together, it's not "engineered".

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

StevePerkins 4y ago

There is no such thing as a "software engineer", period. An "engineer" is someone who works in a technical profession with a governing body. Either the State, or an entity that might as well be the State. An engineer is certified by that governing body, and given a license to practice the profession. An engineer can have their license suspended or rescinded, in the event of professional misconduct or malpractice. Whether through law, or de facto through insurance company practices, employers face liability if they employ non-licensed engineers. So an engineer is someone who has the leverage to push back against employer pressure to commit malpractice. Computer programmers / software developers have none of these things. Certifications are a joke, and meaningless beyond the entry level. We are pressured by employers to commit malpractice on a near-daily basis, and call it "tech debt" (management at my current company is pushing the even more euphemistic term "tech improvement opportunities"). Without a governing body and licensing, it is impossible for us to be "engineers" in any real sense of the professional term. With respect to Margaret Hamilton, we can only try to emulate an engineering profession as best we can, by evangelizing professional standards and pushing back on malpractice pressure where we can.

908B64B197 4y ago
> There is no such thing as a "software engineer", period. That's a bold statement. Would you argue, for instance, that someone graduating from MIT EECS[0] or Stanford Engineering[1] isn't qualified to use the tittle of Engineer? > An engineer is certified by that governing body, and given a license to practice the profession. An engineer can have their license suspended or rescinded, in the event of professional misconduct or malpractice. I think you are confused with the PE regulations. [2] [0] https://www.eecs.mit.edu/ https://www.eecs.mit.edu/ [1] https://engineering.stanford.edu/students-academics/academics/undergraduate-degree-programs https://engineering.stanford.edu/students-academics/academic... [2] https://ncees.org/about/ https://ncees.org/about/
- StevePerkins 4y ago
  Has a governing body issued you a license, without which one cannot practice your profession? No? Then indeed, you are not an "engineer" in the sense of a profession, as with doctors and lawyers and CPA's, etc. This is wholly orthogonal to the prestige of whichever college you graduated. Note that even on your own Stanford and MIT links above, they reserve the term "engineering" for programs OTHER THAN "Computer Science" (e.g. "Chemical Engineering", "Electrical Engineering", etc). Show me a "Software Engineering" program at any accredited university. There's no confusion, I am 100% talking about PE regulations. One requires a license to practice chemical engineering, electrical engineering, mechanical engineering, all but the most entry-level roles in aerospace engineering, etc. Employers effectively cannot hire non-licensed workers for those positions. If that does not apply to your job, then you are an "engineer" only in the sense of LinkedIn puffery. Mind you, this applies to all us (myself included) in the software development field. I'm not trying to be a gatekeeper. Rather, the complete absence of gatekeeping is the entire point here.