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No one has complained about being unable to convert their USDT to USD. This is baseless speculation. It's entirely fair to say there is no basis for trusting t

No one has complained about being unable to convert their USDT to USD. This is baseless speculation. It's entirely fair to say there is no basis for trusting the company behind Tether, and by extension Tether. It's unfounded FUD to definitively claim that it's a scam.

arcticbull 4y ago
The CFTC and NYAG statements said in no uncertain terms that there were long periods of time where Tether did not have the money to cover their obligations. You have lowered the standard to the point where it is significantly easier to meet. All they need to meet your standard is to have inflows in excess of outflows - outflows lower than inflows plus marketable securities. Letitia James says: > The OAG’s investigation found that, starting no later than mid-2017, Tether had no access to banking, anywhere in the world, and so for periods of time held no reserves to back tethers in circulation at the rate of one dollar for every tether, contrary to its representations. The CFTC says: > As found in the order, Tether held sufficient fiat reserves in its accounts to back USDT tether tokens in circulation for only 27.6% of the days in a 26-month sample time period from 2016 through 2018. It's literally not FUD, it's something they paid significant quantities of penalties over.
- ETH_start 4y ago
  No access to banking is not the same thing as not having the reserves. If there was this massive shortfall/scam that you are alleging, those press releases would have spared no details in describing them. >>> As found in the order, Tether held sufficient fiat reserves in its accounts to back USDT tether tokens in circulation for only 27.6% of the days in a 26-month sample time period from 2016 through 2018. You're leaving out critically important context, which is that Tether held other assets as reserves: >>The order further finds that Tether failed to disclose that it included unsecured receivables and non-fiat assets in its reserves Reading your comment without this context would lead a casual observer to conclude that the assets backing the issued USDT held a value of 27.6% of the USDT's face value, which is entirely different than reserves equalling ~100% of USDT in value, but with a significant fraction of assets constituting those reserves not being of zero-risk fiat as the marketing arguably implied.
  - arcticbull 4y ago
    I'm not sure why you're quibbling. At one point Bitfinex reached in and took out hundreds of millions of dollars from the reserves Tether had to cover the money they had lost to Crypto Capital Corp. At the time they had a market cap of about $2B, so that was ~25% of reserves wired out. [4, S. III pages 6-9]. That's just one example. There is, and I can't stress this enough, literally no reason for you or anyone else to trust these people. They've never published audits, one of their auditors (Friedman LLP) literally walked away once they saw their books. Then for some of the attestations, they literally wired money in the same day from Bitfinex, then wired it out the next to make it look like they had the reserves. > If there was this massive shortfall/scam that you are alleging, those press releases would have spared no details in describing them. They did. [1] Also, it was covered in the NYAG settlement and the CFTC settlement I linked. I strongly suggest you give them an actual read-through. The entirety of the section III of the PDF covers it in painstaking detail. > Reading your comment without this context would lead a casual observer to conclude that the assets backing the issued USDT held a value of 27.6% of the USDT's face value, which is entirely different than reserves equalling ~100% of USDT in value, but with a significant fraction of assets constituting those reserves not being of zero-risk fiat as the marketing arguably implied. Not only is that is than an obvious misreading of the comment, it wasn't my comment, it was a direct quote from the CFTC website - but then you go on to claim something I never claimed. Let me be clear then: 1. There periods they were physically unable to fulfill demands because they had no bank account access [4]. 2. At other times, their peer organization raided the kitty and literally took the money (because the same executives gave almost a billion dollars to a company indicted for laundering money for - among others - the Colombian cartels, without a contract, and whose execs are in prison or on trial). [2,3] 3. At other times, they invested in illiquid securities and got rekt (they invested in Celsius for instance). Stop giving these people a lick of credit, stop apologizing for them, and demand some proof. [1] https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2019/04/25/bitfinex-covered-850-million-loss-using-tether-funds-ny-prosecutors-allege/ https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2019/04/25/bitfinex-covered... [2] https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2019/10/25/polish-police-arrest-head-of-payment-processor-tied-to-bitfinex-crypto-exchange/ https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2019/10/25/polish-police-ar... [3] https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/04/25/reggie-fowler-pleads-guilty-in-crypto-capital-corp-case-tied-to-bitfinexs-missing-millions/ https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/04/25/reggie-fowler-p... [4] https://ag.ny.gov/sites/default/files/2021.02.17_-_settlement_agreement_-_execution_version.b-t_signed-c2_oag_signed.pdf https://ag.ny.gov/sites/default/files/2021.02.17_-_settlemen...
cool_dude85 4y ago
I own one tether and I can't have Bitfinex convert it into a dollar for me. Is that good enough for you?
- evdubs 4y ago
  Having Bitfinex convert it for you would mean that you deposit the USDt to Bitfinex and exchange it for 1 USD. Having Tether convert it for you would mean you have an account with Tether and redeem your USDt. Are you saying you can't redeem your 1 USDt for 1 USD because you don't meet the minimum $100,000 conversion?
  - arcticbull 4y ago
    Correct, you cannot redeem USDT via Tether, Inc. unless you meet the minimum deposit. You can trade it on various platforms for dollars from other non-Tether-inc participants. This is all on https://tether.to/legal https://tether.to/legal and/or https://tether.to/en/fees https://tether.to/en/fees Also you can't redeem USDT if you're a U.S. Person, or if you don't meet their definition of customer, at their sole discretion. > In order to cause Tether Tokens to be issued or redeemed directly by Tether, you must be a verified customer of Tether. No exceptions will be made to this provision. The right to have Tether Tokens redeemed or issued is a contractual right personal to you. Tether reserves the right to delay the redemption or withdrawal of Tether Tokens if such delay is necessitated by the illiquidity or unavailability or loss of any Reserves held by Tether to back the Tether Tokens, and Tether reserves the right to redeem Tether Tokens by in-kind redemptions of securities and other assets held in the Reserves. Tether makes no representations or warranties about whether Tether Tokens that may be traded on the Site may be traded on the Site at any point in the future, if at all.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]

arcticbull 4y ago

The CFTC and NYAG statements said in no uncertain terms that there were long periods of time where Tether did not have the money to cover their obligations. You have lowered the standard to the point where it is significantly easier to meet. All they need to meet your standard is to have inflows in excess of outflows - outflows lower than inflows plus marketable securities. Letitia James says: > The OAG’s investigation found that, starting no later than mid-2017, Tether had no access to banking, anywhere in the world, and so for periods of time held no reserves to back tethers in circulation at the rate of one dollar for every tether, contrary to its representations. The CFTC says: > As found in the order, Tether held sufficient fiat reserves in its accounts to back USDT tether tokens in circulation for only 27.6% of the days in a 26-month sample time period from 2016 through 2018. It's literally not FUD, it's something they paid significant quantities of penalties over.

ETH_start 4y ago
No access to banking is not the same thing as not having the reserves. If there was this massive shortfall/scam that you are alleging, those press releases would have spared no details in describing them. >>> As found in the order, Tether held sufficient fiat reserves in its accounts to back USDT tether tokens in circulation for only 27.6% of the days in a 26-month sample time period from 2016 through 2018. You're leaving out critically important context, which is that Tether held other assets as reserves: >>The order further finds that Tether failed to disclose that it included unsecured receivables and non-fiat assets in its reserves Reading your comment without this context would lead a casual observer to conclude that the assets backing the issued USDT held a value of 27.6% of the USDT's face value, which is entirely different than reserves equalling ~100% of USDT in value, but with a significant fraction of assets constituting those reserves not being of zero-risk fiat as the marketing arguably implied.
- arcticbull 4y ago
  I'm not sure why you're quibbling. At one point Bitfinex reached in and took out hundreds of millions of dollars from the reserves Tether had to cover the money they had lost to Crypto Capital Corp. At the time they had a market cap of about $2B, so that was ~25% of reserves wired out. [4, S. III pages 6-9]. That's just one example. There is, and I can't stress this enough, literally no reason for you or anyone else to trust these people. They've never published audits, one of their auditors (Friedman LLP) literally walked away once they saw their books. Then for some of the attestations, they literally wired money in the same day from Bitfinex, then wired it out the next to make it look like they had the reserves. > If there was this massive shortfall/scam that you are alleging, those press releases would have spared no details in describing them. They did. [1] Also, it was covered in the NYAG settlement and the CFTC settlement I linked. I strongly suggest you give them an actual read-through. The entirety of the section III of the PDF covers it in painstaking detail. > Reading your comment without this context would lead a casual observer to conclude that the assets backing the issued USDT held a value of 27.6% of the USDT's face value, which is entirely different than reserves equalling ~100% of USDT in value, but with a significant fraction of assets constituting those reserves not being of zero-risk fiat as the marketing arguably implied. Not only is that is than an obvious misreading of the comment, it wasn't my comment, it was a direct quote from the CFTC website - but then you go on to claim something I never claimed. Let me be clear then: 1. There periods they were physically unable to fulfill demands because they had no bank account access [4]. 2. At other times, their peer organization raided the kitty and literally took the money (because the same executives gave almost a billion dollars to a company indicted for laundering money for - among others - the Colombian cartels, without a contract, and whose execs are in prison or on trial). [2,3] 3. At other times, they invested in illiquid securities and got rekt (they invested in Celsius for instance). Stop giving these people a lick of credit, stop apologizing for them, and demand some proof. [1] https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2019/04/25/bitfinex-covered-850-million-loss-using-tether-funds-ny-prosecutors-allege/ https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2019/04/25/bitfinex-covered... [2] https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2019/10/25/polish-police-arrest-head-of-payment-processor-tied-to-bitfinex-crypto-exchange/ https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2019/10/25/polish-police-ar... [3] https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/04/25/reggie-fowler-pleads-guilty-in-crypto-capital-corp-case-tied-to-bitfinexs-missing-millions/ https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/04/25/reggie-fowler-p... [4] https://ag.ny.gov/sites/default/files/2021.02.17_-_settlement_agreement_-_execution_version.b-t_signed-c2_oag_signed.pdf https://ag.ny.gov/sites/default/files/2021.02.17_-_settlemen...

cool_dude85 4y ago

I own one tether and I can't have Bitfinex convert it into a dollar for me. Is that good enough for you?

evdubs 4y ago
Having Bitfinex convert it for you would mean that you deposit the USDt to Bitfinex and exchange it for 1 USD. Having Tether convert it for you would mean you have an account with Tether and redeem your USDt. Are you saying you can't redeem your 1 USDt for 1 USD because you don't meet the minimum $100,000 conversion?
- arcticbull 4y ago
  Correct, you cannot redeem USDT via Tether, Inc. unless you meet the minimum deposit. You can trade it on various platforms for dollars from other non-Tether-inc participants. This is all on https://tether.to/legal https://tether.to/legal and/or https://tether.to/en/fees https://tether.to/en/fees Also you can't redeem USDT if you're a U.S. Person, or if you don't meet their definition of customer, at their sole discretion. > In order to cause Tether Tokens to be issued or redeemed directly by Tether, you must be a verified customer of Tether. No exceptions will be made to this provision. The right to have Tether Tokens redeemed or issued is a contractual right personal to you. Tether reserves the right to delay the redemption or withdrawal of Tether Tokens if such delay is necessitated by the illiquidity or unavailability or loss of any Reserves held by Tether to back the Tether Tokens, and Tether reserves the right to redeem Tether Tokens by in-kind redemptions of securities and other assets held in the Reserves. Tether makes no representations or warranties about whether Tether Tokens that may be traded on the Site may be traded on the Site at any point in the future, if at all.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]