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Generally, when something like this becomes news, someone is trying to shift the Overton window. Who wants this to be news and to what end are they manipulatin

Generally, when something like this becomes news, someone is trying to shift the Overton window. Who wants this to be news and to what end are they manipulating collective perception? I am so cynical so I respond the opposite way. Good for China, I applaud them for keeping tabs on a nation that routinely use drones in foreign skies to murder civilians.

unity1001 4y ago
> a nation that routinely use drones in foreign skies to murder civilians That? The US flies aircraft across the borders of all targeted nations daily and violates their airspace. But the Anglosaxon media always only talks about how others are doing it, deceiving people to think that only 'others' do such things. Textbook example of lying by omission explained by Chomsky.
stjohnswarts 4y ago
Do you salute them for the way they treat Tibet and Uyghurs?
MomoXenosaga 4y ago
Americans don't have much historical sense but I do. They used to fly spy planes right into USSR airspace- until Gary Powers got shot down. Typical hypocrisy.
blinding-streak 4y ago
China is not exactly pure as the driven snow. Glass houses.
andsoitis 4y ago
Are you saying you trust that China is keeping tabs on the US? In what way do you think they are and what is your mental model for deciding who to trust?
- elzbardico 4y ago
  I am not OP, but I must express my belief that the world was a more harmonious and simpler place for the average person when the United States was not a dominant global power. The fear of communism, in fact, was probably one of the driving forces behind the creation of a thriving middle class in the US. It is probably not a coincidence that since the fall of the Soviet Union, income and wealth disparities have only continued to escalate in the United States, painting a stark picture of the consequences of unchecked hegemonic power.
- zerodensity 4y ago
  I mean of course china keeps tabs on the US. It's good to keep tabs on your investments.
- hermannj314 4y ago
  My mental model of trust is to not buy a car from a salesperson you like. Normally, if you are feeling nice and secure, it is because someone has manipulated you to a place of vulnerability so they can take advantage of you. This story wants me to feel like the US government is prudent, competent and observant. So, naturally, I am scared shitless.
  - Zetobal 4y ago
    I wouldn't stop there I bet your friends are also out to get you. In fact everyone might be out to get you ;]
34611 4y ago
It's like all those "russians testing our airspace" propaganda a few years back. Everybody tests everyone's airspace. It's only when the elites want it to turn it into "news" that you hear about it. Then it's all forgotten. It's just manufactured propaganda. The good thing about this is you can see how propaganda ( aka news/media ) coordinates with the pentagon/intelligence/etc.
AbrahamParangi 4y ago
In what world would this not be news?
- boomboomsubban 4y ago
  In a world where we have constant satellite coverage of the entire planet doing basically what we think this balloon might be doing.
  - AbrahamParangi 4y ago
    And China has many satellites that are not in the news, but violating sovereign airspace Matters regardless of whether or not it materially matters.
    - bigger_inside 4y ago
      Violating sovereign airspace matters to the US only when it's done to the US. Because to the US, the US is the only sovereign country in the world. All the others can and should get routinely violated by US planes, if you believe US media. So yeah, get out of here.
      - AbrahamParangi 4y ago
        This is US news, in a U.S. newspaper, on a US site, in English. I think sometimes people complain that something isn’t news it’s just US news, while they’re on US channels populated or run by US folks. And you know, what do you expect?
        boomboomsubban 4y ago
        That's not their point. The US routinely violates various nation's airspace. Hell, what do you think the odds are the US is currently violating Chinese airspace in some capacity? Depending on who's definition of Chinese airspace you use, it's pretty damn likely.
Rury 4y ago
This. Why do people suspect it's a spy balloon? No reasons are given in the article. Even if it did come from China, it could be nothing more than a mere scientific weather balloon. This smells like propaganda.
- drusepth 4y ago
  Technically, a scientific weather balloon could also be classified as spying on our weather conditions. :)
- t0bia_s 4y ago
  Those Chinese comrades have to be damn good engineers. They released spy balloon in China and magically fly over US. Just wow. Are they really controlling the weather?
  - boomboomsubban 4y ago
    According to Wikipedia, between 2000 and 5000 weather balloons are released daily. China's likely releasing hundreds of those. And there are reports of even regular helium balloons sometimes traveling thousands of miles. It wouldn't be magical for one to accidentally end up basically anywhere.
    - t0bia_s 4y ago
      Isn't that one particular balloon for spying?
      - boomboomsubban 4y ago
        You responded to a post saying >Why do people suspect it's a spy balloon? No reasons are given in the article. Even if it did come from China, it could be nothing more than a mere scientific weather balloon. This smells like propaganda.
        t0bia_s 4y ago
quotemstr 4y ago
It's exhausting how literally every subject of public conversation is an op, isn't it? "The current thing", for any value of "current thing", just isn't worth devoting thought: whatever "the current thing" is, it's just bots and propaganda all the way down.
- BeFlatXIII 4y ago
  > whatever "the current thing" is, it's just bots and propaganda all the way down Exactly. There is there is no true self under all the masks.
Giorgi 4y ago
>routinely use drones in foreign skies to murder civilians. Why would you shift the overton window?
- dontlaugh 4y ago
  If repeating a fact shifts the Overton window, I think some reflection is in order.
  - mensetmanusman 4y ago
    You think it’s true that the US has weekly meetings where they decide which specific civilians to murder with drones?
    - kavouras 4y ago
      The fact that they don't(as far as I know) have weekly meetings where they decide which civilians to murder with drones doesn't mean that they don't murder civilians with drones.
      - mensetmanusman 4y ago
        OP said regularly murdering civilians (intentionally targeting to kill, after meetings on who to target). No one is saying it hasn’t ever happened, but are there weekly/monthly meetings now?

unity1001 4y ago

> a nation that routinely use drones in foreign skies to murder civilians That? The US flies aircraft across the borders of all targeted nations daily and violates their airspace. But the Anglosaxon media always only talks about how others are doing it, deceiving people to think that only 'others' do such things. Textbook example of lying by omission explained by Chomsky.

stjohnswarts 4y ago

Do you salute them for the way they treat Tibet and Uyghurs?

MomoXenosaga 4y ago

Americans don't have much historical sense but I do. They used to fly spy planes right into USSR airspace- until Gary Powers got shot down. Typical hypocrisy.

blinding-streak 4y ago

China is not exactly pure as the driven snow. Glass houses.

andsoitis 4y ago

Are you saying you trust that China is keeping tabs on the US? In what way do you think they are and what is your mental model for deciding who to trust?

elzbardico 4y ago
I am not OP, but I must express my belief that the world was a more harmonious and simpler place for the average person when the United States was not a dominant global power. The fear of communism, in fact, was probably one of the driving forces behind the creation of a thriving middle class in the US. It is probably not a coincidence that since the fall of the Soviet Union, income and wealth disparities have only continued to escalate in the United States, painting a stark picture of the consequences of unchecked hegemonic power.
zerodensity 4y ago
I mean of course china keeps tabs on the US. It's good to keep tabs on your investments.
hermannj314 4y ago
My mental model of trust is to not buy a car from a salesperson you like. Normally, if you are feeling nice and secure, it is because someone has manipulated you to a place of vulnerability so they can take advantage of you. This story wants me to feel like the US government is prudent, competent and observant. So, naturally, I am scared shitless.
- Zetobal 4y ago
  I wouldn't stop there I bet your friends are also out to get you. In fact everyone might be out to get you ;]

34611 4y ago

It's like all those "russians testing our airspace" propaganda a few years back. Everybody tests everyone's airspace. It's only when the elites want it to turn it into "news" that you hear about it. Then it's all forgotten. It's just manufactured propaganda. The good thing about this is you can see how propaganda ( aka news/media ) coordinates with the pentagon/intelligence/etc.

AbrahamParangi 4y ago

In what world would this not be news?

boomboomsubban 4y ago
In a world where we have constant satellite coverage of the entire planet doing basically what we think this balloon might be doing.
- AbrahamParangi 4y ago
  And China has many satellites that are not in the news, but violating sovereign airspace Matters regardless of whether or not it materially matters.
  - bigger_inside 4y ago
    Violating sovereign airspace matters to the US only when it's done to the US. Because to the US, the US is the only sovereign country in the world. All the others can and should get routinely violated by US planes, if you believe US media. So yeah, get out of here.
    - AbrahamParangi 4y ago
      This is US news, in a U.S. newspaper, on a US site, in English. I think sometimes people complain that something isn’t news it’s just US news, while they’re on US channels populated or run by US folks. And you know, what do you expect?
      - boomboomsubban 4y ago
        That's not their point. The US routinely violates various nation's airspace. Hell, what do you think the odds are the US is currently violating Chinese airspace in some capacity? Depending on who's definition of Chinese airspace you use, it's pretty damn likely.

Rury 4y ago

This. Why do people suspect it's a spy balloon? No reasons are given in the article. Even if it did come from China, it could be nothing more than a mere scientific weather balloon. This smells like propaganda.

drusepth 4y ago
Technically, a scientific weather balloon could also be classified as spying on our weather conditions. :)
t0bia_s 4y ago
Those Chinese comrades have to be damn good engineers. They released spy balloon in China and magically fly over US. Just wow. Are they really controlling the weather?
- boomboomsubban 4y ago
  According to Wikipedia, between 2000 and 5000 weather balloons are released daily. China's likely releasing hundreds of those. And there are reports of even regular helium balloons sometimes traveling thousands of miles. It wouldn't be magical for one to accidentally end up basically anywhere.
  - t0bia_s 4y ago
    Isn't that one particular balloon for spying?
    - boomboomsubban 4y ago
      You responded to a post saying >Why do people suspect it's a spy balloon? No reasons are given in the article. Even if it did come from China, it could be nothing more than a mere scientific weather balloon. This smells like propaganda.
      - t0bia_s 4y ago

quotemstr 4y ago

It's exhausting how literally every subject of public conversation is an op, isn't it? "The current thing", for any value of "current thing", just isn't worth devoting thought: whatever "the current thing" is, it's just bots and propaganda all the way down.

BeFlatXIII 4y ago
> whatever "the current thing" is, it's just bots and propaganda all the way down Exactly. There is there is no true self under all the masks.

Giorgi 4y ago

>routinely use drones in foreign skies to murder civilians. Why would you shift the overton window?

dontlaugh 4y ago
If repeating a fact shifts the Overton window, I think some reflection is in order.
- mensetmanusman 4y ago
  You think it’s true that the US has weekly meetings where they decide which specific civilians to murder with drones?
  - kavouras 4y ago
    The fact that they don't(as far as I know) have weekly meetings where they decide which civilians to murder with drones doesn't mean that they don't murder civilians with drones.
    - mensetmanusman 4y ago
      OP said regularly murdering civilians (intentionally targeting to kill, after meetings on who to target). No one is saying it hasn’t ever happened, but are there weekly/monthly meetings now?