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> Every American should understand that the police are not your friends. But they should also understand that policy are rarely the enemy, either, and treating

> Every American should understand that the police are not your friends. But they should also understand that policy are rarely the enemy, either, and treating them as such will result in a worse outcome on average. Don't let the evening news distort reality so much. Also, in the interest of sharing anecdotal get off my lawn moments, all the kids in my neighborhood walk to school too, in 2023. All weather, all the time, safely, nobody calls the cops, nobody gets grabbed, it's fine. The world is in fact objectively safer than it was when I was growing up in the 80s. There's a good reason I don't routinely watch the news or read partisan political media.

MSFT_Edging 4y ago
The point of "police are not your friends", is you can't know which cop has a chip on their shoulder until its too late and you're three teeth short of a smile. The nature of policing and the logic behind "ACAB" is that because police don't keep their peers in line, you cannot trust any cop. "One bad apple" has been corrupted just like "Pick yourself up by your bootstraps". The former cuts off "spoils the bunch", the latter being a satire for something obviously impossible.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
LarryMullins 4y ago
My general approach is to be as polite as can be while saying virtually nothing. If the first words out of your mouth after getting pulled over are "AM I BEING DETAINED?!?" then the police are going to make you have a very bad day. My brother had to learn this the hard way, he learned that 'tactic' from reddit I think, and it got him face down on the pavement for what should have been a speeding ticket. Just stay calm and never say anything more than the most vague pleasantries. If they ask where I'm going then it's either "to home", "to work" or "to the store"; they aren't owed answers to these questions and reddit will tell you to sperg out and start ranting about your rights, but if you stay calm and pleasant albeit distant, then the police will be more inclined to treat you the same. But if you antagonize them within the bounds of the law, they'll step outside the law to get you back. You're just setting yourself up for failure in the common case when you follow popular internet advice about cops.
- pstuart 4y ago
  Good advice. Also helps to be white.
  - air7 4y ago
    This reminds me of this skit by Chris Rock: https://youtu.be/uj0mtxXEGE8 https://youtu.be/uj0mtxXEGE8
    - pstuart 4y ago
      Better yet, Eddie Murphy nails it with this "documentary": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_LeJfn_qW0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_LeJfn_qW0
  - LarryMullins 4y ago
    That may be true, but it's not actionable advice on an individual level. I think there's a tendency, particularly on reddit, to let perfect be the enemy of good in situations like this. Reddit will tell people that if you're not white then there's nothing you can do to get better behavior from cops and that advice such as mine above is therefore invalid. Being black in America changes the baseline interaction you can expect on average, but I think my advice will still do most people more good than harm most of the time. If you want to have a boring incident free traffic stop, the best you can do is play your role in such an exchange and hope the cop reciprocates. Conform to the pattern of a mundane traffic stop so that the cop falls into the same pattern. If instead you play the role of some sort of agitated sovereign citizen, the cops will almost certainly reciprocate. In the first case, nothing is ever guaranteed but in the second case a negative outcome of some sort is virtually certain. BTW I think this advice applies generally to almost all encounters with strangers, not just cops. Superficial politeness is a superpower. It works on anyone from troublesome new neighbors, crazy threatening people you encounter on the street at night, even stiff indifferent bureaucrats. Superficial politeness gets better outcomes from almost everybody, most of the time.
- fnimick 4y ago
  > if you antagonize them within the bounds of the law, they'll step outside the law to get you back. This is exactly the problem. Police shouldn't be allowed to mete out extrajudicial punishment for being offended.
jjk166 4y ago
> But they should also understand that policy are rarely the enemy, either, and treating them as such will result in a worse outcome on average. If you are afraid of what will happen to you if you don't comply with everything someone says, they are your enemy.

MSFT_Edging 4y ago

The point of "police are not your friends", is you can't know which cop has a chip on their shoulder until its too late and you're three teeth short of a smile. The nature of policing and the logic behind "ACAB" is that because police don't keep their peers in line, you cannot trust any cop. "One bad apple" has been corrupted just like "Pick yourself up by your bootstraps". The former cuts off "spoils the bunch", the latter being a satire for something obviously impossible.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

LarryMullins 4y ago

My general approach is to be as polite as can be while saying virtually nothing. If the first words out of your mouth after getting pulled over are "AM I BEING DETAINED?!?" then the police are going to make you have a very bad day. My brother had to learn this the hard way, he learned that 'tactic' from reddit I think, and it got him face down on the pavement for what should have been a speeding ticket. Just stay calm and never say anything more than the most vague pleasantries. If they ask where I'm going then it's either "to home", "to work" or "to the store"; they aren't owed answers to these questions and reddit will tell you to sperg out and start ranting about your rights, but if you stay calm and pleasant albeit distant, then the police will be more inclined to treat you the same. But if you antagonize them within the bounds of the law, they'll step outside the law to get you back. You're just setting yourself up for failure in the common case when you follow popular internet advice about cops.

pstuart 4y ago
Good advice. Also helps to be white.
- air7 4y ago
  This reminds me of this skit by Chris Rock: https://youtu.be/uj0mtxXEGE8 https://youtu.be/uj0mtxXEGE8
  - pstuart 4y ago
    Better yet, Eddie Murphy nails it with this "documentary": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_LeJfn_qW0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_LeJfn_qW0
- LarryMullins 4y ago
  That may be true, but it's not actionable advice on an individual level. I think there's a tendency, particularly on reddit, to let perfect be the enemy of good in situations like this. Reddit will tell people that if you're not white then there's nothing you can do to get better behavior from cops and that advice such as mine above is therefore invalid. Being black in America changes the baseline interaction you can expect on average, but I think my advice will still do most people more good than harm most of the time. If you want to have a boring incident free traffic stop, the best you can do is play your role in such an exchange and hope the cop reciprocates. Conform to the pattern of a mundane traffic stop so that the cop falls into the same pattern. If instead you play the role of some sort of agitated sovereign citizen, the cops will almost certainly reciprocate. In the first case, nothing is ever guaranteed but in the second case a negative outcome of some sort is virtually certain. BTW I think this advice applies generally to almost all encounters with strangers, not just cops. Superficial politeness is a superpower. It works on anyone from troublesome new neighbors, crazy threatening people you encounter on the street at night, even stiff indifferent bureaucrats. Superficial politeness gets better outcomes from almost everybody, most of the time.
fnimick 4y ago
> if you antagonize them within the bounds of the law, they'll step outside the law to get you back. This is exactly the problem. Police shouldn't be allowed to mete out extrajudicial punishment for being offended.

jjk166 4y ago

> But they should also understand that policy are rarely the enemy, either, and treating them as such will result in a worse outcome on average. If you are afraid of what will happen to you if you don't comply with everything someone says, they are your enemy.