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You won't believe how things changed since then. You need to install at least dozen applications on macOS to come near to features/capabilities of a run of the

You won't believe how things changed since then. You need to install at least dozen applications on macOS to come near to features/capabilities of a run of the mill KDE desktop. GNOME also improved a ton, it seems, but I'm not using it for a long long time. macOS is lean, but doesn't have the composability and flexibility of Linux at any level. Things designed to add this composability feels bolted on loosely and limited at utility.

pjmlp 4y ago
The typical reply from Linux folks, "but things have improved so much", including missing the point I am aware of the current experience. Most folks don't want a "go fishing experience", they want a prepared meal.
- bayindirh 4y ago
  Well, I'm pretty aware that you know current experience way better than all of us, combined. On the other hand, our parents, partners and non-technical friends use their Linux systems without ever calling us, the venerable yet dumb as a dead tree "Linux folks".
  - pjmlp 4y ago
    Unless you're speaking about ChromeOS and Android, which take the Linux kernel as implementation detail, and replace the GNU userspace with Web and Java based technologies, I pretty much doubt it, given the 2% market share of Linux Desktop usage across the globe.
    - bayindirh 4y ago
      Nope. I'm talking about people using GNU/Linux systems. These people are our relatives, and our friends. We see with our eyes, chat every day. Maybe I'm on an island with everyone which makes this 2%, but these people are real, and they are not compiling things from source or throwing their machines out of windows because of frustration. They just use their computers, be productive and live happy lives.
alxlaz 4y ago
> You need to install at least dozen applications on macOS to come near to features/capabilities of a run of the mill KDE desktop. I can get my run of the mill KDE desktop to hang at startup by dragging a networked folder with a custom icon to the taskbar, then attempt to log in over a flaky network connection. Or if I attempt to drag too many application icons to it in the Wayland session. Don't get me wrong, I like it, I mean, I use it, but Plasma 5 is still, at best, late beta. My only hope is that, unlike its predecessor, it doesn't get abandoned and rewritten when it gets a semblance of stability.
- bayindirh 4y ago
  Plasma on Wayland is a late beta yes, because Wayland itself is a late beta. I'd not use Wayland, yet if I want to use KDE, and if I need to install Wayland, I'd use another desktop environment. I never restart KDE on my system, unless I upgrade my kernel, and restart the whole system.
  - alxlaz 4y ago
    Yeah, see, the fine print kills it. It's a "rock solid"* desktop, it does everything I want. * Unless you use large network mounts, as long as you drag icons one at a time, for a fixed screen resolution, doesn't apply to Wayland, only until the next major rewrite...
    - bayindirh 4y ago
      The fine print can be rewritten as follows: *:Unless you use with Wayland backend, since Wayland is not mature enough. Because my installation both has large network mounts, and I sometimes drag tons* of icons around.
      - alxlaz 4y ago
        Yeah, the fine print also needs a "works on my machine" bit :-).

pjmlp 4y ago

The typical reply from Linux folks, "but things have improved so much", including missing the point I am aware of the current experience. Most folks don't want a "go fishing experience", they want a prepared meal.

bayindirh 4y ago
Well, I'm pretty aware that you know current experience way better than all of us, combined. On the other hand, our parents, partners and non-technical friends use their Linux systems without ever calling us, the venerable yet dumb as a dead tree "Linux folks".
- pjmlp 4y ago
  Unless you're speaking about ChromeOS and Android, which take the Linux kernel as implementation detail, and replace the GNU userspace with Web and Java based technologies, I pretty much doubt it, given the 2% market share of Linux Desktop usage across the globe.
  - bayindirh 4y ago
    Nope. I'm talking about people using GNU/Linux systems. These people are our relatives, and our friends. We see with our eyes, chat every day. Maybe I'm on an island with everyone which makes this 2%, but these people are real, and they are not compiling things from source or throwing their machines out of windows because of frustration. They just use their computers, be productive and live happy lives.

alxlaz 4y ago

> You need to install at least dozen applications on macOS to come near to features/capabilities of a run of the mill KDE desktop. I can get my run of the mill KDE desktop to hang at startup by dragging a networked folder with a custom icon to the taskbar, then attempt to log in over a flaky network connection. Or if I attempt to drag too many application icons to it in the Wayland session. Don't get me wrong, I like it, I mean, I use it, but Plasma 5 is still, at best, late beta. My only hope is that, unlike its predecessor, it doesn't get abandoned and rewritten when it gets a semblance of stability.

bayindirh 4y ago
Plasma on Wayland is a late beta yes, because Wayland itself is a late beta. I'd not use Wayland, yet if I want to use KDE, and if I need to install Wayland, I'd use another desktop environment. I never restart KDE on my system, unless I upgrade my kernel, and restart the whole system.
- alxlaz 4y ago
  Yeah, see, the fine print kills it. It's a "rock solid"* desktop, it does everything I want. * Unless you use large network mounts, as long as you drag icons one at a time, for a fixed screen resolution, doesn't apply to Wayland, only until the next major rewrite...
  - bayindirh 4y ago
    The fine print can be rewritten as follows: *:Unless you use with Wayland backend, since Wayland is not mature enough. Because my installation both has large network mounts, and I sometimes drag tons* of icons around.
    - alxlaz 4y ago
      Yeah, the fine print also needs a "works on my machine" bit :-).