4 ms·

This is just not true let's take something very basic, the kanji 人 has two on'yomi pronunciations, jin and nin and there's no way to tell which one to use with

by iopq 4y ago

This is just not true let's take something very basic, the kanji 人 has two on'yomi pronunciations, jin and nin and there's no way to tell which one to use without knowing ALL of the words it will be used in 日本人 - nihonjin, so far so good 三人 - sannin, okay, I guess there's two pronunciations 二人 - futari, huh? 一人 - hitori, wat so please tell me how I am supposed to know 人生 (jinsei) from 人気 (ninki) from 恋人 (koibito) from 大人 (otona) even ignoring the irregular reading for "adult" there's still no way to tell those three readings apart in a kanji as basic as person

ickoonite 4y ago
Precisely. A couple more: 隼人 (hayato), 盗人 (nusutto). Or we could enumerate the pronunciations of 日: 日々、日曜日 (which is top-tier insane), 日本、春日、本日、明日、明後日、今日 (take your pick which one I mean), 昨日 (ditto), 一日 (ditto), 二日、十四日〜十五日、二十日〜二十一日｡｡｡ One can marvel at its complexity - relish it even - but one cannot deny it.
wst_ 4y ago
I think taking sides in this debate is pointless. Languages are always as difficult as far they are from your mother tongue or other languages you know. Your question about the reading, though, has quite a simple answer. It's pretty obvious how to read all the examples given when you look at them as words, not a single character. Kanji does not exist in a vacuum. 人気 is "ninki" and 大人 is "otona" - no other way around it. Combination of those characters, usually, have one and only reading. To tell the truth, in English, people are unconsciously reading words as a whole, too.
- iopq 4y ago
  Great, so what is 大人気? if it's 大人気ない it's probably childish, but if it's not in that context, it's probably very popular You need to finish reading the whole SENTENCE to be able to pronounce it
  - wst_ 4y ago
    Not sure I agree with that. It's not difficult to notice one has "nai", other don't. Also when you read it in actual sentence you can immediately notice that something is wrong when you choose the wrong reading. Subsequent words don't add up. I am not saying confusion doesn't occur. I'm just saying it's not as big as people are painting it.
    - iopq 4y ago
      It's not always the case it's followed by nai 大人気なくてもいい means it's okay to be childish
rjh29 4y ago
You basically have to memorise them, like with any other language (e.g. the rules and exceptions of English spelling and pronunciation). Usually it's the most common words that have weird exceptions, because we use them enough to remember them. All the words you mention are beginner words. (There's also 人気=ひとけ, just for fun). As far as jin and nin goes... (source: 漢語からみえる世界と世間) jin is more about adjectives/nouns - describing yourself, and part of your identity. 日本人、アメリカ人、原始人、現代人 are all じん. 読書人（どくしょじん） is used to describe people who really love reading. Similarly 暇人（ひまじん）. nin is more of a plain descriptor. 管理人、運搬人、苦労人、被告人 are all にん, as well as 三人.
- iopq 4y ago
  Based on your rules, you would not be able to predict 人気 ninki, 人類 jinrui Why is popularity "plain" and humanity is "identity"? You just have to memorize ALL of the compounds, there's no other way

by iopq 4y ago

ickoonite 4y ago

Precisely. A couple more: 隼人 (hayato), 盗人 (nusutto). Or we could enumerate the pronunciations of 日: 日々、日曜日 (which is top-tier insane), 日本、春日、本日、明日、明後日、今日 (take your pick which one I mean), 昨日 (ditto), 一日 (ditto), 二日、十四日〜十五日、二十日〜二十一日｡｡｡ One can marvel at its complexity - relish it even - but one cannot deny it.

wst_ 4y ago

I think taking sides in this debate is pointless. Languages are always as difficult as far they are from your mother tongue or other languages you know. Your question about the reading, though, has quite a simple answer. It's pretty obvious how to read all the examples given when you look at them as words, not a single character. Kanji does not exist in a vacuum. 人気 is "ninki" and 大人 is "otona" - no other way around it. Combination of those characters, usually, have one and only reading. To tell the truth, in English, people are unconsciously reading words as a whole, too.

iopq 4y ago
Great, so what is 大人気? if it's 大人気ない it's probably childish, but if it's not in that context, it's probably very popular You need to finish reading the whole SENTENCE to be able to pronounce it
- wst_ 4y ago
  Not sure I agree with that. It's not difficult to notice one has "nai", other don't. Also when you read it in actual sentence you can immediately notice that something is wrong when you choose the wrong reading. Subsequent words don't add up. I am not saying confusion doesn't occur. I'm just saying it's not as big as people are painting it.
  - iopq 4y ago
    It's not always the case it's followed by nai 大人気なくてもいい means it's okay to be childish

rjh29 4y ago

You basically have to memorise them, like with any other language (e.g. the rules and exceptions of English spelling and pronunciation). Usually it's the most common words that have weird exceptions, because we use them enough to remember them. All the words you mention are beginner words. (There's also 人気=ひとけ, just for fun). As far as jin and nin goes... (source: 漢語からみえる世界と世間) jin is more about adjectives/nouns - describing yourself, and part of your identity. 日本人、アメリカ人、原始人、現代人 are all じん. 読書人（どくしょじん） is used to describe people who really love reading. Similarly 暇人（ひまじん）. nin is more of a plain descriptor. 管理人、運搬人、苦労人、被告人 are all にん, as well as 三人.

iopq 4y ago
Based on your rules, you would not be able to predict 人気 ninki, 人類 jinrui Why is popularity "plain" and humanity is "identity"? You just have to memorize ALL of the compounds, there's no other way