38 ms·

"Her story is sure to be a compelling one and a great example of what the right mindset can achieve regardless of your situation." Am I the only one who is not

"Her story is sure to be a compelling one and a great example of what the right mindset can achieve regardless of your situation." Am I the only one who is not comfortable with this outlier / (perhaps romanticized) story being used to justify that homeless people _can_ do something about their situation (so if they don't they really are trash and deserve their condition!)? Of course they can, but the potential barrier is just way too high (compared to correct living conditions citizens) for the journalist to consider we are being human enough.

forgotAgain 15y ago
I think you're reading to much into it. It's okay to enjoy an inspirational story and just leave it at that.
obtu 15y ago
That line felt dismissive. The news tidbit is interesting, and that kind of loaded message tacked at the end takes away from it. She is succeeding despite stacked odds, and her situation isn't something that can be brushed off.
tryitnow 15y ago
Well, I have little to no respect for journalistic ability these days so I would expect "feel good" lines to be thrown into an otherwise factual story. My issue with the "mindset is everything" idea is that it is, itself scientifically false. And no, I don't think its to any one's benefit to believe bullshit. You can bet some slimy "self help" guru is already planning to feature this story in his next sales pitch. The problem with this idea is that it gives false hope to people who either lack the natural (genetic) ability or the social support structures (family, supportive schools, access to research facilities, etc) to succeed. There were obviously several factors important to her success: innate genetic potential, a supportive family, access to supportive researchers. To isolate and credit one factor just perpetuates myths that do no one any good. Finally the thing that I find most amusing about the "mindset is everything" idea is that mindset itself has a large genetic component and to the extent it can be enhanced it requires some pretty heavy intervention (cognitive behavior therapy, possibly certain meditation practices). See the fnords (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fnord http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fnord) guys, they're always there.
scarmig 15y ago
That really rubbed me the wrong way as well: it sucks that now something as unloaded as doing your best and hard work has become a politicized Horatio Alger statement about how the right mindset can achieve anything regardless of where you come from. My first reaction was to want to say that the reporter should ask her opinion on if anyone can achieve great things regardless of their station in life, but that goes too far in the other direction. Instead the article should just state the facts about how she has achieved what she did without trying to discern any political or moral points from it. Apart from the meta stuff, she sounds awesome. I usually grumble at these things because privilege plays such a big role--and who knows, maybe she has her own form of privileges that aren't represented by homelessness--but she managed to beat the odds. Good for her.
srdev 15y ago
I'm not comfortable with using an outlier as a data point, no. I'm also not comfortable when outliers are also used to prove the opposite (effort is useless, luck is everything, etc). We should not be using outliers to form our understanding about how the world works, period.
esrauch 15y ago
It's odd how completely opposite I understand that same sentence. I understand that sentence to be the same as: "Her story is sure to be a compelling one and a great example of the extreme barriers the right mindset can overcome. In this case, an exceptional person managed to overcome even the apparently insurmountable barrier to get out of their dire situation."

forgotAgain 15y ago

I think you're reading to much into it. It's okay to enjoy an inspirational story and just leave it at that.

obtu 15y ago

That line felt dismissive. The news tidbit is interesting, and that kind of loaded message tacked at the end takes away from it. She is succeeding despite stacked odds, and her situation isn't something that can be brushed off.

tryitnow 15y ago

Well, I have little to no respect for journalistic ability these days so I would expect "feel good" lines to be thrown into an otherwise factual story. My issue with the "mindset is everything" idea is that it is, itself scientifically false. And no, I don't think its to any one's benefit to believe bullshit. You can bet some slimy "self help" guru is already planning to feature this story in his next sales pitch. The problem with this idea is that it gives false hope to people who either lack the natural (genetic) ability or the social support structures (family, supportive schools, access to research facilities, etc) to succeed. There were obviously several factors important to her success: innate genetic potential, a supportive family, access to supportive researchers. To isolate and credit one factor just perpetuates myths that do no one any good. Finally the thing that I find most amusing about the "mindset is everything" idea is that mindset itself has a large genetic component and to the extent it can be enhanced it requires some pretty heavy intervention (cognitive behavior therapy, possibly certain meditation practices). See the fnords (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fnord http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fnord) guys, they're always there.

scarmig 15y ago

That really rubbed me the wrong way as well: it sucks that now something as unloaded as doing your best and hard work has become a politicized Horatio Alger statement about how the right mindset can achieve anything regardless of where you come from. My first reaction was to want to say that the reporter should ask her opinion on if anyone can achieve great things regardless of their station in life, but that goes too far in the other direction. Instead the article should just state the facts about how she has achieved what she did without trying to discern any political or moral points from it. Apart from the meta stuff, she sounds awesome. I usually grumble at these things because privilege plays such a big role--and who knows, maybe she has her own form of privileges that aren't represented by homelessness--but she managed to beat the odds. Good for her.

srdev 15y ago

I'm not comfortable with using an outlier as a data point, no. I'm also not comfortable when outliers are also used to prove the opposite (effort is useless, luck is everything, etc). We should not be using outliers to form our understanding about how the world works, period.

esrauch 15y ago

It's odd how completely opposite I understand that same sentence. I understand that sentence to be the same as: "Her story is sure to be a compelling one and a great example of the extreme barriers the right mindset can overcome. In this case, an exceptional person managed to overcome even the apparently insurmountable barrier to get out of their dire situation."