4 ms·

The rumor is that the pi is having issues because Broadcom (who actually owns the IP in their chips) is pissed that they built a for profit company on top of IP

The rumor is that the pi is having issues because Broadcom (who actually owns the IP in their chips) is pissed that they built a for profit company on top of IP Broadcom donated intending to be going to a nonprofit. Rumor is that's also why there's no progress on an RPi5, as that would require coordination with Broadcom. That would also explain why the Pico had no problems being stocked, as it contains no Broadcom IP blocks. I think Framework is probably fine for the foreseeable future.

walterbell 4y ago
If RPi5 has challenges with Broadcom IP licensing, isn't that an opportunity to create a new SBC product line without Broadcom IP, as many FooPi clones have done?
- monocasa 4y ago
  So much about the full RPi is the Broadcom hardware blocks though. If software didn't really care about those, the FooPi clones would have taken off. Turns out a lot of software targeting RPi actually twiddles those hardware blocks directly.
  - walterbell 4y ago
    In that case, Broadcom should be happy that their loss-leading IP has created a gigantic market with unfulfilled demand. They can negotiate a volume agreement with two tiers of product: one for hobbyists, one for commercial integrators. Review existing RPi commercial use cases to identify features for product segmentation enhancement. Price RPi commercial IP the same as other commercial users of Broadcom IP.
    - nicoburns 4y ago
      They should be. Unfortunately that doesn't mean they will be! Broadcom aren't exactly known for an open minded approach to IP.
      - walterbell 4y ago
        They still have time to avoid snatching defeat from the jaws of unplanned network-effect victory :)
nicoburns 4y ago
My hope is that eventually will get a Raspberry PI (or something similarly well supported at a software level) based on a RISC V processor that doesn't have these IP issues. I guess it might be difficult to do that for things like WiFi though.
- monocasa 4y ago
  Same. I'm hoping that Pine64's STAR64 fills that space. https://wiki.pine64.org/wiki/STAR64 https://wiki.pine64.org/wiki/STAR64
wkat4242 4y ago
As a "community" member I have to say it was annoying when they started prioritizing the integrators during the parts shortage. It feels more like a generic dev board supplier now than an educational / maker focused product. The compute model in particular was a mistake IMO. I'm sure they do great business but their original focus is lost.
mytailorisrich 4y ago
It's not Broadcom IP, all the Pi apart Pico are based on Broadcom chips, which indeed may explain why Pico does not seem to be impacted by supply issues, as you point out. The likelihood is therefore that supply issues are because of Broadcom...
- monocasa 4y ago
  The chips past the BCM2835 have been a collaboration between Broadcom and the Raspberry Pi Foundation, with rpi taking on a larger share of the work as time goes on.

walterbell 4y ago

If RPi5 has challenges with Broadcom IP licensing, isn't that an opportunity to create a new SBC product line without Broadcom IP, as many FooPi clones have done?

monocasa 4y ago
So much about the full RPi is the Broadcom hardware blocks though. If software didn't really care about those, the FooPi clones would have taken off. Turns out a lot of software targeting RPi actually twiddles those hardware blocks directly.
- walterbell 4y ago
  In that case, Broadcom should be happy that their loss-leading IP has created a gigantic market with unfulfilled demand. They can negotiate a volume agreement with two tiers of product: one for hobbyists, one for commercial integrators. Review existing RPi commercial use cases to identify features for product segmentation enhancement. Price RPi commercial IP the same as other commercial users of Broadcom IP.
  - nicoburns 4y ago
    They should be. Unfortunately that doesn't mean they will be! Broadcom aren't exactly known for an open minded approach to IP.
    - walterbell 4y ago
      They still have time to avoid snatching defeat from the jaws of unplanned network-effect victory :)

nicoburns 4y ago

My hope is that eventually will get a Raspberry PI (or something similarly well supported at a software level) based on a RISC V processor that doesn't have these IP issues. I guess it might be difficult to do that for things like WiFi though.

monocasa 4y ago
Same. I'm hoping that Pine64's STAR64 fills that space. https://wiki.pine64.org/wiki/STAR64 https://wiki.pine64.org/wiki/STAR64

wkat4242 4y ago

As a "community" member I have to say it was annoying when they started prioritizing the integrators during the parts shortage. It feels more like a generic dev board supplier now than an educational / maker focused product. The compute model in particular was a mistake IMO. I'm sure they do great business but their original focus is lost.

mytailorisrich 4y ago

It's not Broadcom IP, all the Pi apart Pico are based on Broadcom chips, which indeed may explain why Pico does not seem to be impacted by supply issues, as you point out. The likelihood is therefore that supply issues are because of Broadcom...

monocasa 4y ago
The chips past the BCM2835 have been a collaboration between Broadcom and the Raspberry Pi Foundation, with rpi taking on a larger share of the work as time goes on.