35 ms·

Microsoft Windows is a malware in the first place. Replaced it with Linux since 1996, never had any problems with 'viruses' since then. My parents still buys a

by zoobab 4y ago

Microsoft Windows is a malware in the first place. Replaced it with Linux since 1996, never had any problems with 'viruses' since then. My parents still buys antiviruses for Windows, I told them to switch to Ubuntu long ago.

gradExMachina 4y ago
The online consensus seems to be that Windows Defender (M$'s) is likely the best AV for windows. Perhaps you could tell them to get malwarebytes if they feel the need for one.
- account42 4y ago
  IME, Windows Defender does not care about false positives any more than the other vendors.
  - radlad 4y ago
    I think the parent was just trying to save OP's parents some money. > My parents still buys antiviruses for Windows
    - gradExMachina 4y ago
      That was my intention.
- grapesurgeon 4y ago
  [dead]
squarefoot 4y ago
> My parents still buys antiviruses for Windows, I told them to switch to Ubuntu long ago. If I may offer some advice, don't tell elderly people to change anything, especially about things they're not familiar with, like computers are for many of them. The more people grow old, the more they need familiarity with things. During the years, also thanks to the transition to become a grey beard myself, I've learned the lesson and adopted a different approach, both for relatives and customers: I offer to solve problems at minimum effort, that is, no more viruses, lost data due to OS or software crashes, licenses and their expiration, planned obsolescence and subsequent need to buy new hardware, etc. It goes like "I'm giving you something much better with all your data where you expect them to be; you use it for a while, then after some time if you don't feel comfortable I'll revert it back exactly like before, for free". The "free" part of course is needed outside of family and friends. It is important to keep technical data for ourselves because every term they don't understand would reinforce the perception that Linux can't be used by non technical people and they would fear it long before even having seen it in action. If they ask "what's Linux?" the answer should be like "something like Windows but less problematic" and nothing more. I've started to experience success stories in migrating Windows users to Linux the day I've stopped expecting they could understand what is a compiler, a kernel or the GNU philosophy.
- vorpalhex 4y ago
  I'm not unsympathetic to your approach, but I have also had users who went from "What is linux?" to recompiling kernels in a couple weeks with no guidance. Sometimes giving users a bit of rope does lead to good outcomes.
- GoblinSlayer 4y ago
  In fact today linux looks more windows than windows itself.
- MadcapJake 4y ago
  > don't tell elderly people to change anything, especially about things they're not familiar with, like computers are for many of them. Where does this belief come from? Sure it will be challenging for them to get up to speed in a new environment but i don't think there is any rule against learning new things at that age. I would argue that new and different can help improve their mind. Is there any recent science that has provided insight into this?
  - squarefoot 4y ago
    You're right of course, I was referring mostly to people who aren't familiar with computers. Not that they can't learn new things, but it becomes more difficult with age, and really difficult if one doesn't grok computers already. I might take for example my family, literally filled with people with multiple university degrees, but all the older ones struggled when it came to use computers or learn technical things, while the younger ones like me, my brother and cousins never had problems with that.
  - account42 4y ago
    My mom gets nervous as soon as there is an unexpected window on the screen. Don't understimate how confusing computers can be to those who did not grow up with them even if they regularly (have to) use them now. Computers are incredibly complex and if you have not developed an intuition for them then you really can't know if something being different means that you messed up or if it is just a normal change. This doesn't just apply to old people (see e.g. people used to Windows tryng Linux or vice versa, people used to GUIs being afraid of the command line) but IME they do seem to be more prone to it. > I would argue that new and different can help improve their mind. If it is something they want to learn, probably yes. If it is something forced upon them while they are trying to do something completely different, it can just as well make them even less receptive to learning new technology.
ropintus 4y ago
Unfortunately, Linux will never gain any meaningful market share in the desktop market. Every Linux distro is hostile to their users in some way. I am saying this as a person who actively dislikes windows. Over the years I have tried many Linux distro and none of them is good enough. 1. The Ubuntu fails to wake after sleep (none of the online solution worked for me) 2. I installed openSUSE, but I tried to browse their forums for an issue, I learned that their forum is blocked in my country. Went back to Ubuntu in a few hours. 3. Fedora was very good for a time, wine worked without any tinkering, but the latest update to 37 made my system very slow. Flatpak was not working. It also had issues working with Nvidia drivers. 4. Even tried Arch Linux (you can guess, how that went). On the other hand, Microsoft is doing everything to appease their users. The Excel software have a bug to maintain backward compatibility. I won't recommend any Windows users to switch to Linux.
greenn 4y ago
Linux desktop users specifically don't have to worry about malware or ransomware until it gets significant usage. Just like people used to say Macs don't get viruses until enough people used them. Last time I checked (could be very out of date) Linux doesn't have any way to enforce code signing requirements, even in the kernel.

by zoobab 4y ago

gradExMachina 4y ago

The online consensus seems to be that Windows Defender (M$'s) is likely the best AV for windows. Perhaps you could tell them to get malwarebytes if they feel the need for one.

account42 4y ago
IME, Windows Defender does not care about false positives any more than the other vendors.
- radlad 4y ago
  I think the parent was just trying to save OP's parents some money. > My parents still buys antiviruses for Windows
  - gradExMachina 4y ago
    That was my intention.
grapesurgeon 4y ago
[dead]

squarefoot 4y ago

> My parents still buys antiviruses for Windows, I told them to switch to Ubuntu long ago. If I may offer some advice, don't tell elderly people to change anything, especially about things they're not familiar with, like computers are for many of them. The more people grow old, the more they need familiarity with things. During the years, also thanks to the transition to become a grey beard myself, I've learned the lesson and adopted a different approach, both for relatives and customers: I offer to solve problems at minimum effort, that is, no more viruses, lost data due to OS or software crashes, licenses and their expiration, planned obsolescence and subsequent need to buy new hardware, etc. It goes like "I'm giving you something much better with all your data where you expect them to be; you use it for a while, then after some time if you don't feel comfortable I'll revert it back exactly like before, for free". The "free" part of course is needed outside of family and friends. It is important to keep technical data for ourselves because every term they don't understand would reinforce the perception that Linux can't be used by non technical people and they would fear it long before even having seen it in action. If they ask "what's Linux?" the answer should be like "something like Windows but less problematic" and nothing more. I've started to experience success stories in migrating Windows users to Linux the day I've stopped expecting they could understand what is a compiler, a kernel or the GNU philosophy.

vorpalhex 4y ago
I'm not unsympathetic to your approach, but I have also had users who went from "What is linux?" to recompiling kernels in a couple weeks with no guidance. Sometimes giving users a bit of rope does lead to good outcomes.
GoblinSlayer 4y ago
In fact today linux looks more windows than windows itself.
MadcapJake 4y ago
> don't tell elderly people to change anything, especially about things they're not familiar with, like computers are for many of them. Where does this belief come from? Sure it will be challenging for them to get up to speed in a new environment but i don't think there is any rule against learning new things at that age. I would argue that new and different can help improve their mind. Is there any recent science that has provided insight into this?
- squarefoot 4y ago
  You're right of course, I was referring mostly to people who aren't familiar with computers. Not that they can't learn new things, but it becomes more difficult with age, and really difficult if one doesn't grok computers already. I might take for example my family, literally filled with people with multiple university degrees, but all the older ones struggled when it came to use computers or learn technical things, while the younger ones like me, my brother and cousins never had problems with that.
- account42 4y ago
  My mom gets nervous as soon as there is an unexpected window on the screen. Don't understimate how confusing computers can be to those who did not grow up with them even if they regularly (have to) use them now. Computers are incredibly complex and if you have not developed an intuition for them then you really can't know if something being different means that you messed up or if it is just a normal change. This doesn't just apply to old people (see e.g. people used to Windows tryng Linux or vice versa, people used to GUIs being afraid of the command line) but IME they do seem to be more prone to it. > I would argue that new and different can help improve their mind. If it is something they want to learn, probably yes. If it is something forced upon them while they are trying to do something completely different, it can just as well make them even less receptive to learning new technology.

ropintus 4y ago

Unfortunately, Linux will never gain any meaningful market share in the desktop market. Every Linux distro is hostile to their users in some way. I am saying this as a person who actively dislikes windows. Over the years I have tried many Linux distro and none of them is good enough. 1. The Ubuntu fails to wake after sleep (none of the online solution worked for me) 2. I installed openSUSE, but I tried to browse their forums for an issue, I learned that their forum is blocked in my country. Went back to Ubuntu in a few hours. 3. Fedora was very good for a time, wine worked without any tinkering, but the latest update to 37 made my system very slow. Flatpak was not working. It also had issues working with Nvidia drivers. 4. Even tried Arch Linux (you can guess, how that went). On the other hand, Microsoft is doing everything to appease their users. The Excel software have a bug to maintain backward compatibility. I won't recommend any Windows users to switch to Linux.

greenn 4y ago

Linux desktop users specifically don't have to worry about malware or ransomware until it gets significant usage. Just like people used to say Macs don't get viruses until enough people used them. Last time I checked (could be very out of date) Linux doesn't have any way to enforce code signing requirements, even in the kernel.