3 ms·

> Us workers already have Universal protections and job security while striking even if they're not in a union. No need for sick time, huh. Mat leave, pat leav

> Us workers already have Universal protections and job security while striking even if they're not in a union. No need for sick time, huh. Mat leave, pat leave. Generally US worker protections are some of the weakest in the developed world. So yeah I mean it's possible that these can be achieved without unionization, they definitely haven't been. A lot of those protections you allude to were actually obtained because of unions. The weekend, and not locking workers in leading to them burning to death in downtown New York are all thanks to organized labor. [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triangle_Shirtwaist_Factory_fire https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triangle_Shirtwaist_Factory_fi...

s1artibartfast 4y ago
We are specifically talking about tech workers here. They generally do have extensive sick time and leave policies. >So yeah I mean it's possible that these can be achieved without unionization, they definitely haven't been. Maybe I'm missing something, but almost all big tech companies have these and never had a union. >The weekend, and not locking workers in leading to them burning to death in downtown New York are all thanks to organized labor. When was the last time US programmers were locked in an office? I have never heard of this as a big issue.
- arcticbull 4y ago
  > We are specifically talking about tech workers here. They generally do have extensive sick time and leave policies. We were talking universal protections. I said they don't exist. It's disingenuous to then pivot back to not just tech, but specifically big tech. Plenty of smaller companies have less generous policies. This isn't the case in places that have the universal protections of which you spoke. Although on second reading you may have been referring to individuals striking only. Universal protections around striking specifically are pretty dismal, with extremely limited enforcement in the US. Also, what good is a strike without organization? You gonna get three people outside holding up a sign? Strikes only work if you get enough people doing it. > Maybe I'm missing something, but almost all big tech companies have these and never had a union. Correct, but workers are the beneficiaries of policies that were brought in thanks to predecessor unions and the organized labor movement. This is like saying that we don't need the EPA anymore because the Cuyahoga hasn't caught fire in a while. > When was the last time US programmers were locked in an office? I have never heard of this as a big issue. You can thank a union for that. Feel free to read the wikipedia article I linked you in my original reply and circle back. Specifically the 'consequences and legacy' section. The history of worker rights everywhere (and the US is no exception) was written in blood.
- Apocryphon 4y ago
  Recently it’s been more about U.S. programmers locked out of their offices.

s1artibartfast 4y ago

We are specifically talking about tech workers here. They generally do have extensive sick time and leave policies. >So yeah I mean it's possible that these can be achieved without unionization, they definitely haven't been. Maybe I'm missing something, but almost all big tech companies have these and never had a union. >The weekend, and not locking workers in leading to them burning to death in downtown New York are all thanks to organized labor. When was the last time US programmers were locked in an office? I have never heard of this as a big issue.

arcticbull 4y ago
> We are specifically talking about tech workers here. They generally do have extensive sick time and leave policies. We were talking universal protections. I said they don't exist. It's disingenuous to then pivot back to not just tech, but specifically big tech. Plenty of smaller companies have less generous policies. This isn't the case in places that have the universal protections of which you spoke. Although on second reading you may have been referring to individuals striking only. Universal protections around striking specifically are pretty dismal, with extremely limited enforcement in the US. Also, what good is a strike without organization? You gonna get three people outside holding up a sign? Strikes only work if you get enough people doing it. > Maybe I'm missing something, but almost all big tech companies have these and never had a union. Correct, but workers are the beneficiaries of policies that were brought in thanks to predecessor unions and the organized labor movement. This is like saying that we don't need the EPA anymore because the Cuyahoga hasn't caught fire in a while. > When was the last time US programmers were locked in an office? I have never heard of this as a big issue. You can thank a union for that. Feel free to read the wikipedia article I linked you in my original reply and circle back. Specifically the 'consequences and legacy' section. The history of worker rights everywhere (and the US is no exception) was written in blood.
Apocryphon 4y ago
Recently it’s been more about U.S. programmers locked out of their offices.