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Not sure about “worst” but I really hate that they’ve made the menu bar taller than the notch on the MacBook Pro— why on Earth would you do that?! I also don’t

Not sure about “worst” but I really hate that they’ve made the menu bar taller than the notch on the MacBook Pro— why on Earth would you do that?! I also don’t love the new settings app or the trend toward highly graphical, touchscreen style bundled apps, but I can ignore most of them so it’s not a huge deal.

ClassyJacket 4y ago
On that note... why do the MacBooks even have a notch considering: A) FaceID is tiny now, look at the iPhone 14, and B) No Mac has FaceID anyway. What's in there apart from a tiny camera and light sensor? There's no way those two things can take up that much space.
- satvikpendem 4y ago
  Seems to be for future face ID. Apple uses the same chassis for years as the manufacturing cost of changing out the chassis every year is unnecessary, especially with Tim Cook's operational background.
- MichaelZuo 4y ago
  It's to allow the fingers someplace safe to apply leverage against when opening the lid. Which is why I think the screen is so much more fragile then the previous model. Lots of users don't care about placing their fingers in the right spot and stress-wear the LCD.
  - cafeinux 4y ago
    That sounds like bad UX.
    - MichaelZuo 4y ago
      Yes, it seems like Jony Ive was the only one in senior management who had the authority to unilaterally block these bad design decisions.
  - hjkl0 4y ago
    Any references for that? Wouldn’t you avoid that spot with your fingers, to keep it from getting greasy and smudged?
    - MichaelZuo 4y ago
      If you avoid the spot, how could you open the lid without touching the LCD?
- Tagbert 4y ago
  FaceID is much thicker than the lid in a MacBook. The phones are much thicker. If you were to add it, there would need to be a wart on the lid to make space for it. TouchId works well the the keyboard-oriented interface of a laptop so there is little additional benefit to FaceID. In the iOS implementations, you still need a special button to authorize purchases with FaceID, so it doesn’t help in that situation. BTW the notch is that size because the model contains a camera and two separate sensors as well as mounting features. It is larger than you might think. It may be possible to reengineer it to be smaller in later versions of the MacBooks. https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-MacBook-Pro-s-notch-houses-more-than-just-a-1080p-camera.574456.0.html https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-MacBook-Pro-s-notch-hous...
  - wenc 4y ago
    Touch ID does not work well during the winter in northern climates. The lack of humidity leads to dry fingertips that Touch ID does not recognize consistently. I have 5 finger prints saved - and every couple of weeks Touch ID fails to recognize any due to dry fingers. I’ve just gotten used to entering the numeric passcode instead. In contrast Face ID rarely fails.
    - acdha 4y ago
      The problem I have with Touch ID is when my fingers are wet, such as after swimming or washing dishes. Face ID works well there, but not when I'm wearing a mask/scarf, so I really wonder what the cost differential would be for adding both. The feature which as come in handy for me most is that feature to unlock with Apple Watch which covers most of both scenarios but then you need a fairly expensive second accessory which not everyone would otherwise find worthwhile.
      - wenc 4y ago
        Face ID works with both masks and scarves (at the price of less security - it only uses the area around the eyes for auth) — you have to enable it in Settings. This was a feature added during the pandemic when folks started wearing masks.
- hjkl0 4y ago
  The notch is branding. A bigger question is why it was changed for the iPhone 14 Pro.
WillAdams 4y ago
Doesn't this depend on the UI size one sets the screen to?
- barnabee 4y ago
  I have "more space" set, which still does not give me back those pixels.
Tagbert 4y ago
The menubar is slightly taller than the notch due to how the human visual system deals with lines close to each other. A curve (notch corner) intersecting with a line (menubar bottom edge) tend to make the line look bent and it looks wrong. Having the bottom edge of the menubar offset from the notch avoids that visual artifact. As a bonus, it keeps the notch from looking like it is pushing into the content area and it makes the notch look a little smaller. This kind of attention to detail has historically been a hallmark of Apple’s sophisticated design sense. They don’t always go the extra mile on it but when they do, it makes a difference. I like the navigation of the new Settings app over the older Control Panel but the individual panels seem incomplete. Mac OS is not the same as iOS and I would hope that they spend some time optimizing the controls and layout of those settings apps for Mac OS.
- diebeforei485 4y ago
  > A curve (notch corner) intersecting with a line (menubar bottom edge) tend to make the line look bent and it looks wrong. Is there a name for this optical illusion?
- barnabee 4y ago
  I never noticed any issue on the notch/menu bar before but I notice the wasted pixels on maximised and fullscreen apps. Mac OS doesn't even use those pixels below the notch if you enable auto hide on the menu bar, which I find midly ridiculous. I generally dislike the trend towards excessive whitespace everywhere and apps that look like web pages. I find it particularly egregious when it's an unavoidable part of the whole OS. I'd love an option for more compact "data dense" layouts in general.

ClassyJacket 4y ago

On that note... why do the MacBooks even have a notch considering: A) FaceID is tiny now, look at the iPhone 14, and B) No Mac has FaceID anyway. What's in there apart from a tiny camera and light sensor? There's no way those two things can take up that much space.

satvikpendem 4y ago
Seems to be for future face ID. Apple uses the same chassis for years as the manufacturing cost of changing out the chassis every year is unnecessary, especially with Tim Cook's operational background.
MichaelZuo 4y ago
It's to allow the fingers someplace safe to apply leverage against when opening the lid. Which is why I think the screen is so much more fragile then the previous model. Lots of users don't care about placing their fingers in the right spot and stress-wear the LCD.
- cafeinux 4y ago
  That sounds like bad UX.
  - MichaelZuo 4y ago
    Yes, it seems like Jony Ive was the only one in senior management who had the authority to unilaterally block these bad design decisions.
- hjkl0 4y ago
  Any references for that? Wouldn’t you avoid that spot with your fingers, to keep it from getting greasy and smudged?
  - MichaelZuo 4y ago
    If you avoid the spot, how could you open the lid without touching the LCD?
Tagbert 4y ago
FaceID is much thicker than the lid in a MacBook. The phones are much thicker. If you were to add it, there would need to be a wart on the lid to make space for it. TouchId works well the the keyboard-oriented interface of a laptop so there is little additional benefit to FaceID. In the iOS implementations, you still need a special button to authorize purchases with FaceID, so it doesn’t help in that situation. BTW the notch is that size because the model contains a camera and two separate sensors as well as mounting features. It is larger than you might think. It may be possible to reengineer it to be smaller in later versions of the MacBooks. https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-MacBook-Pro-s-notch-houses-more-than-just-a-1080p-camera.574456.0.html https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-MacBook-Pro-s-notch-hous...
- wenc 4y ago
  Touch ID does not work well during the winter in northern climates. The lack of humidity leads to dry fingertips that Touch ID does not recognize consistently. I have 5 finger prints saved - and every couple of weeks Touch ID fails to recognize any due to dry fingers. I’ve just gotten used to entering the numeric passcode instead. In contrast Face ID rarely fails.
  - acdha 4y ago
    The problem I have with Touch ID is when my fingers are wet, such as after swimming or washing dishes. Face ID works well there, but not when I'm wearing a mask/scarf, so I really wonder what the cost differential would be for adding both. The feature which as come in handy for me most is that feature to unlock with Apple Watch which covers most of both scenarios but then you need a fairly expensive second accessory which not everyone would otherwise find worthwhile.
    - wenc 4y ago
      Face ID works with both masks and scarves (at the price of less security - it only uses the area around the eyes for auth) — you have to enable it in Settings. This was a feature added during the pandemic when folks started wearing masks.
hjkl0 4y ago
The notch is branding. A bigger question is why it was changed for the iPhone 14 Pro.

WillAdams 4y ago

Doesn't this depend on the UI size one sets the screen to?

barnabee 4y ago
I have "more space" set, which still does not give me back those pixels.

Tagbert 4y ago

The menubar is slightly taller than the notch due to how the human visual system deals with lines close to each other. A curve (notch corner) intersecting with a line (menubar bottom edge) tend to make the line look bent and it looks wrong. Having the bottom edge of the menubar offset from the notch avoids that visual artifact. As a bonus, it keeps the notch from looking like it is pushing into the content area and it makes the notch look a little smaller. This kind of attention to detail has historically been a hallmark of Apple’s sophisticated design sense. They don’t always go the extra mile on it but when they do, it makes a difference. I like the navigation of the new Settings app over the older Control Panel but the individual panels seem incomplete. Mac OS is not the same as iOS and I would hope that they spend some time optimizing the controls and layout of those settings apps for Mac OS.

diebeforei485 4y ago
> A curve (notch corner) intersecting with a line (menubar bottom edge) tend to make the line look bent and it looks wrong. Is there a name for this optical illusion?
barnabee 4y ago
I never noticed any issue on the notch/menu bar before but I notice the wasted pixels on maximised and fullscreen apps. Mac OS doesn't even use those pixels below the notch if you enable auto hide on the menu bar, which I find midly ridiculous. I generally dislike the trend towards excessive whitespace everywhere and apps that look like web pages. I find it particularly egregious when it's an unavoidable part of the whole OS. I'd love an option for more compact "data dense" layouts in general.