6 ms·
> for grid use, where a discharge time of days to months is useful. Not sure I know the use case for a duration of that length. It's possible today with pumpe
by gumby 4y ago
> for grid use, where a discharge time of days to months is useful.
Not sure I know the use case for a duration of that length. It's possible today with pumped hydro, but I don't think it's used in that mode.
The DoE's "long duration storage earthshot" effort is loking for 10+ hours, which makes more sense: https://www.energy.gov/eere/long-duration-storage-shot https://www.energy.gov/eere/long-duration-storage-shot
- jfoutz 4y agoThe standard reply to any sort of gravity storage is "geography and land availability". I don't find that argument compelling enough to dismiss gravity storage outright, but I'll admit Oklahoma is pretty darn flat. Chemical storage could be a big win when a mountain isn't readily available. Or the land is too expensive to use for power storage.
- marmadukester39 4y agoDecommissioned mines. Saw an article about it somewhere recently.
- bobthepanda 4y agoReally, you just need any elevation difference. I would imagine Oklahoma already builds water towers.
- michaelt 4y agoA zero-carbon northern Europe that replaced all gas heating with heat pumps would benefit from being able to store electricity during the warm summer months, to power heating in the cold winter months. There are other options, of course - new nuclear plants, importing renewable power from countries with better weather, huge numbers of wind turbines, and so on - but cost-effective long-term power storage would address some issues if it was available.
- nl 4y agoThe times when there is insufficient wind and insufficient solar somewhere within transmission range of Europe are so small (hours) that this long term energy storage isn't something anyone is trying to build. Better long distance transmission infrastructure is a much better solution to this.
- ilyt 4y agoWinter happens at same time in Europe. Unless we're talking shipping all the way from Africa
- hollerith 4y agoUntil something adversarial happens to your transmission infrastructure similar to what happened to Nord Stream 1 and 2 a few months ago.
- nl 4y agoYes, black swan events happen for all kind of power sources. Depending on your risk tolerance you overbuild to reduce that. Same as with all types of energy production.
- adrianN 4y agoThere is a tradeoff between overprovisioning renewables, improving transmission networks and storage. Where the cheapest solution lies is not clear yet.
- 4y ago
- m463 4y agoWhat about a couple days of overcast/rain (solar) or a couple days of stagnant air (wind) where storage would bridge the gap?
- toast0 4y agoIf the numbers work out (which, I suspect they don't), putting batteries at substations could provide continuous power to customers when the substation is isolated from the grid by a wiring fault. That shouldn't take months to fix, but sometimes it takes days (in my area, it's usually trees falling during storms, and the roads are dangerous during such times, so it takes some time for repairs). Might be nice anyway, and help with grid stabilization when the wiring is intact.