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I find those exaggerated: > I don't really program in Common Lisp any more. I program in a little custom language that I have incrementally built on top of Com

I find those exaggerated: > I don't really program in Common Lisp any more. I program in a little custom language that I have incrementally built on top of Common Lisp over the years so yeah, that's CL. ergolib is a CL library, like any other, with a cool macro to learn, if you want. > A CL programmer looking at my code would probably go, "WAT?" it's OK :] There are still defun and opening parens. > a fragmented ecosystem of little sub-languages but what sub-languages are we talking about? I only see a library with helper functions and macros. That's Common Lisp, not a derivative. You can pick any other library of the ecosystem, it's compatible, like Serapeum, another common library with many useful stuff baked-in, compatible with all CL implementations. I don't call that a fragmented ecosystem. Only some authors have their fav' utility and that's ok. Last words re implementations, for new readers: SBCL is thriving, LispWorks and ACL deliver, ABCL and ECL are active, CLASP (CL on LLVM) is financed and active, GNU CL got a new release, someone in Japan started a new implementation in C, someone else on Savannah another one in C again… And CCL is not thriving unfortunately :( There is room for contributors (there's some backing, contact the CL Foundation).

lisper 4y ago
In Lisp, the boundary between a little macro library and new language is fuzzy. But my code looks pretty radically different from textbook CL code, much more different that, say, Scheme code looks from textbook CL code, and no one would dispute that Scheme is a different language. Maybe I should have said that I don't code in idiomatic CL any more. > SBCL is thriving... Indeed. The CL ecosystem in general is doing very well. It is only CCL that is fading away, and hopefully even that is only a temporary setback.
phoe-krk 4y ago
> but what sub-languages are we talking about? I only see a library with helper functions and macros. That's Common Lisp, not a derivative. If your language is a DSL factory, the line between your language and DSLs naturally blurs. If https://github.com/y2q-actionman/with-c-syntax https://github.com/y2q-actionman/with-c-syntax exists, does it mean that C is a DSL of Common Lisp, given a good enough standard library? If https://github.com/calyau/maxima https://github.com/calyau/maxima exists, does it mean that Maxima is just Common Lisp with more maths? If https://github.com/Shen-Language/shen-cl https://github.com/Shen-Language/shen-cl and https://github.com/coalton-lang/coalton/ https://github.com/coalton-lang/coalton/ exist, does it mean that Shen and Coalton are just a fancy way of writing Common Lisp in an immutable way? If https://github.com/froggey/Iota https://github.com/froggey/Iota exists and we can play sdlquake on Mezzano, does it mean that LLVM-IR is a dialect of Common Lisp? The above series of questions is not meant to be fully credible - it's meant to be food for thought.

lisper 4y ago

In Lisp, the boundary between a little macro library and new language is fuzzy. But my code looks pretty radically different from textbook CL code, much more different that, say, Scheme code looks from textbook CL code, and no one would dispute that Scheme is a different language. Maybe I should have said that I don't code in idiomatic CL any more. > SBCL is thriving... Indeed. The CL ecosystem in general is doing very well. It is only CCL that is fading away, and hopefully even that is only a temporary setback.

phoe-krk 4y ago

> but what sub-languages are we talking about? I only see a library with helper functions and macros. That's Common Lisp, not a derivative. If your language is a DSL factory, the line between your language and DSLs naturally blurs. If https://github.com/y2q-actionman/with-c-syntax https://github.com/y2q-actionman/with-c-syntax exists, does it mean that C is a DSL of Common Lisp, given a good enough standard library? If https://github.com/calyau/maxima https://github.com/calyau/maxima exists, does it mean that Maxima is just Common Lisp with more maths? If https://github.com/Shen-Language/shen-cl https://github.com/Shen-Language/shen-cl and https://github.com/coalton-lang/coalton/ https://github.com/coalton-lang/coalton/ exist, does it mean that Shen and Coalton are just a fancy way of writing Common Lisp in an immutable way? If https://github.com/froggey/Iota https://github.com/froggey/Iota exists and we can play sdlquake on Mezzano, does it mean that LLVM-IR is a dialect of Common Lisp? The above series of questions is not meant to be fully credible - it's meant to be food for thought.