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> If the government wants sidewalks, they should be maintained by the city and contiguous with the street. I'm not sure why this isn't the case everywhere. We

> If the government wants sidewalks, they should be maintained by the city and contiguous with the street. I'm not sure why this isn't the case everywhere. We all want sidewalks, they are a public space and a public good, they should be maintained from the public purse (as are the roads)

phpisthebest 4y ago
>>We all want sidewalks Clearly we all do not, I do not. I never use them, I do not want to pay for them, I do not want my tax money to pay for them
- GalenErso 4y ago
  I want sidewalks. I use them. I want to pay for them. I want my (and your) tax money to pay for them. And I vote.
  - patrick451 4y ago
    "I want you to buy me stuff" is such a childish argument.
    - jewayne 4y ago
      There's nothing childish about wanting your neighborhood and city to be livable.
      - patrick451 4y ago
        Neighborhoods without sidewalks are perfectly livable, evidenced by the many people currently living there. Try again.
  - phpisthebest 4y ago
    And you believe it is ethical to use threats of violence to force me to pay for those Sidewalks Because that is what voting for it does. All government actions are backed by the threat of violence if you do not comply
    - paulryanrogers 4y ago
      Yes. I believe only the threat of violence will overcome the selfishness that creates prisoner dilemmas. Dilemas such as funding public education, safe road and walkways, police, fire, and healthcare services. Even those who disagree would probably change their mind after a few years without such services.
      - phpisthebest 4y ago
        At least your honest most people attempt to deny the basic reality of government. Now the question is why do you believe the government force is not only the best but the only way to provide "public education, safe road and walkways, police, fire, and healthcare services." because not only do I not agree that government is needed for society to have those things, government providing them is of lower quality, especially in the case of "education" i.e schools, and police.
        wittycardio 4y ago
        [dead]
        paulryanrogers 4y ago
        History is my guide. Private towns, money, police, armies, schools, healthcare have largely been a disaster. Exceptions exist where private enterprise has sometimes worked better than government. And today we even have corporations so rich and influencial they are defacto governments. Ultimately I believe collective action and a monopoly on violence is best. Therefore a government, even if by another name, is the answer. Ideally one responsive to the people they rule.
        phpisthebest 4y ago
        >>History is my guide. as it is for me, and governments are a disaster. I am unclear how you can look at governments in history and not see a pattern of abuse, dysfunction, corruption, and over all terrible evil >>And today we even have corporations so rich and influencial they are defacto governments. Why do we have these mega corporations? I believe it is because of government, decades of regulatory capture by companies have made it impossible to be in business with out being a huge company these regulatory protectionist policies are what is driving out small business and the competition. you see companies as the root of the evil.. I see beyond the companies and see their protectors the State as the root cause of this evil >>Ideally one responsive to the people they rule. Many problems here, even your terminology betrays your goals for if a government "rules over" the people the people by definition have no power over that government. Violence is never "best", Using governmental force to impose a vision on others is intellectual sloth and typically results in unintended, perverse consequences.
- paulryanrogers 4y ago
  Do you want your children to grow up healthy, with lower risk of being struck by traffic? Right now my kids are home schooled. Yet I gladly pay some of the highest school taxes in the area. Because I want my kids to grow up and perhaps marry in a literate society. Even when I didn't have kids I learned to appreciate living with people educated outside their family bubble.
- ElevenLathe 4y ago
  Right, a minority of us are grumpy and claim for reasons of political aesthetics that they don't, but most of us want sidewalks, roads, running water, electrical service, trash pickup, animal control, schools, libraries, and parks.

phpisthebest 4y ago

>>We all want sidewalks Clearly we all do not, I do not. I never use them, I do not want to pay for them, I do not want my tax money to pay for them

GalenErso 4y ago
I want sidewalks. I use them. I want to pay for them. I want my (and your) tax money to pay for them. And I vote.
- patrick451 4y ago
  "I want you to buy me stuff" is such a childish argument.
  - jewayne 4y ago
    There's nothing childish about wanting your neighborhood and city to be livable.
    - patrick451 4y ago
      Neighborhoods without sidewalks are perfectly livable, evidenced by the many people currently living there. Try again.
- phpisthebest 4y ago
  And you believe it is ethical to use threats of violence to force me to pay for those Sidewalks Because that is what voting for it does. All government actions are backed by the threat of violence if you do not comply
  - paulryanrogers 4y ago
    Yes. I believe only the threat of violence will overcome the selfishness that creates prisoner dilemmas. Dilemas such as funding public education, safe road and walkways, police, fire, and healthcare services. Even those who disagree would probably change their mind after a few years without such services.
    - phpisthebest 4y ago
      At least your honest most people attempt to deny the basic reality of government. Now the question is why do you believe the government force is not only the best but the only way to provide "public education, safe road and walkways, police, fire, and healthcare services." because not only do I not agree that government is needed for society to have those things, government providing them is of lower quality, especially in the case of "education" i.e schools, and police.
      - wittycardio 4y ago
        [dead]
      - paulryanrogers 4y ago
        History is my guide. Private towns, money, police, armies, schools, healthcare have largely been a disaster. Exceptions exist where private enterprise has sometimes worked better than government. And today we even have corporations so rich and influencial they are defacto governments. Ultimately I believe collective action and a monopoly on violence is best. Therefore a government, even if by another name, is the answer. Ideally one responsive to the people they rule.
        phpisthebest 4y ago
        >>History is my guide. as it is for me, and governments are a disaster. I am unclear how you can look at governments in history and not see a pattern of abuse, dysfunction, corruption, and over all terrible evil >>And today we even have corporations so rich and influencial they are defacto governments. Why do we have these mega corporations? I believe it is because of government, decades of regulatory capture by companies have made it impossible to be in business with out being a huge company these regulatory protectionist policies are what is driving out small business and the competition. you see companies as the root of the evil.. I see beyond the companies and see their protectors the State as the root cause of this evil >>Ideally one responsive to the people they rule. Many problems here, even your terminology betrays your goals for if a government "rules over" the people the people by definition have no power over that government. Violence is never "best", Using governmental force to impose a vision on others is intellectual sloth and typically results in unintended, perverse consequences.
paulryanrogers 4y ago
Do you want your children to grow up healthy, with lower risk of being struck by traffic? Right now my kids are home schooled. Yet I gladly pay some of the highest school taxes in the area. Because I want my kids to grow up and perhaps marry in a literate society. Even when I didn't have kids I learned to appreciate living with people educated outside their family bubble.
ElevenLathe 4y ago
Right, a minority of us are grumpy and claim for reasons of political aesthetics that they don't, but most of us want sidewalks, roads, running water, electrical service, trash pickup, animal control, schools, libraries, and parks.