3 ms·

No surprise to see the majority on this website defending Apple's production of massive amounts of e-waste for the sake of "security and privacy" because that's

by bakugo 4y ago

No surprise to see the majority on this website defending Apple's production of massive amounts of e-waste for the sake of "security and privacy" because that's that the marketing tells them and they don't actually understand the topic at all.

judge2020 4y ago
Less security (a small-time attacker isn't going to break the encryption) and more reduction/prevention of theft. These Macs end up in recycling centers because thieves know they'll get banned/a strike from eBay if they sell an activation locked device to a customer and that customer complains to the site, so the recycling centers end up being the ones trying to resell/reuse the devices only when most of the ones they get are from thieves (or, as it turns out, IT departments that don't disassociate MDM).
tzs 4y ago
It's not "massive amounts of e-waste". There are a couple cases to consider. 1. Individual sales of used devices to individual buyers. You only get e-waste in this case if (a) the seller doesn't realize they need to unlock the device first, and (b) they buyer doesn't realize that the device needs to be unlocked by the seller, and (c) once the buyer receives the device and notices it needs to be unlocked (which they will notice the first time they try to use it) the buyer cannot make an arrangement with the seller to unlock it. This should be very rare, because even if the seller doesn't realize the device is locked they are probably going to realize that they have plenty of personal data on it they need to erase first, and are going to Google something like "wipe Mac before selling" or "erase Mac before selling" and the first result is going to be Apple's "What to do before you sell, give away, or trade in your Mac" article. 2. Sales to entities that deal in used computers. Similar analysis to #1, except in this case the buyer definitely should know about how locking works and the need to ensure that the seller unlocks it. If the seller cannot ensure it is unlocked the buyer should offer a lot less money. The difference in value between an unlocked device and a locked one is large, so the seller should be willing to unlock it. We should then only get e-waste in the case where the seller cannot unlock it. If the seller cannot unlock it because they legitimately owned it but somehow forgot the necessary credentials, they can get Apple to unlock it if they can show Apple proof of legitimate ownership. Corporate sellers tend to keep purchase records for these kind of things so this should be no problem. Individual owners often don't keep such records, but the number of individuals selling used Apple devices who have forgotten their credentials is very likely quite low.
fsociety 4y ago
Would you like to elaborate on the security and privacy aspect? Otherwise you are dunking on folks without a substantive argument.

by bakugo 4y ago

judge2020 4y ago

Less security (a small-time attacker isn't going to break the encryption) and more reduction/prevention of theft. These Macs end up in recycling centers because thieves know they'll get banned/a strike from eBay if they sell an activation locked device to a customer and that customer complains to the site, so the recycling centers end up being the ones trying to resell/reuse the devices only when most of the ones they get are from thieves (or, as it turns out, IT departments that don't disassociate MDM).

tzs 4y ago

It's not "massive amounts of e-waste". There are a couple cases to consider. 1. Individual sales of used devices to individual buyers. You only get e-waste in this case if (a) the seller doesn't realize they need to unlock the device first, and (b) they buyer doesn't realize that the device needs to be unlocked by the seller, and (c) once the buyer receives the device and notices it needs to be unlocked (which they will notice the first time they try to use it) the buyer cannot make an arrangement with the seller to unlock it. This should be very rare, because even if the seller doesn't realize the device is locked they are probably going to realize that they have plenty of personal data on it they need to erase first, and are going to Google something like "wipe Mac before selling" or "erase Mac before selling" and the first result is going to be Apple's "What to do before you sell, give away, or trade in your Mac" article. 2. Sales to entities that deal in used computers. Similar analysis to #1, except in this case the buyer definitely should know about how locking works and the need to ensure that the seller unlocks it. If the seller cannot ensure it is unlocked the buyer should offer a lot less money. The difference in value between an unlocked device and a locked one is large, so the seller should be willing to unlock it. We should then only get e-waste in the case where the seller cannot unlock it. If the seller cannot unlock it because they legitimately owned it but somehow forgot the necessary credentials, they can get Apple to unlock it if they can show Apple proof of legitimate ownership. Corporate sellers tend to keep purchase records for these kind of things so this should be no problem. Individual owners often don't keep such records, but the number of individuals selling used Apple devices who have forgotten their credentials is very likely quite low.

fsociety 4y ago

Would you like to elaborate on the security and privacy aspect? Otherwise you are dunking on folks without a substantive argument.