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I don't think most people truly appreciate how difficult hydrogen is to work with. It is nothing like fossil fuels which can happily sit in a regular tank for e

I don't think most people truly appreciate how difficult hydrogen is to work with. It is nothing like fossil fuels which can happily sit in a regular tank for extended periods of time and be fine.

theshrike79 4y ago
Way too many people advocating for hydrogen vehicles seriously have an idea in their mind where they just pour hydrogen into a their current vehicle, and it'll still make the comforting brr-brr sounds they're used to. They don't actually want a hydrogen vehicle, they just don't want an EV and use "hydrogen is coming Soon(tm)" as justification for it.
- _hypx 4y ago
  People have actually looked seriously at what a world of only EVs would look like. It is basically a disaster of unsustainable resource consumption. Hence the need for hydrogen cars. EV believers have their own misperceptions about what is a good idea and what isn't.
  - theshrike79 4y ago
    These "People" tend to have an agenda. Like the one report that warned us that the earth didn't have enough lithium to electrify everything. Turns out they calculated that we need, for some reason, enough batteries to store a full month's worth of global electricity production in batteries. No wonder they got the fancy headline :D Battery tech is constantly evolving. There are cobalt-free and lithium-free batteries in the pipeline already. We even have wood-based batteries on experimental stage: https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20221215-the-batteries-made-from-wood https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20221215-the-batteries-ma...
    - _hypx 4y ago
      Should be noted that fuel cells are batteries. We can already eliminate this problem right away. But we must "wait" for future batteries for no reason at all.
      - askvictor 4y ago
        No, fuel cells consume fuel; effectively they are oxidising it in order to make electricity directly. For a hydrogen fuel cell, you still need to add hydrogen when it runs out. Whereas a battery (in the accepted usage of the word) is self-contained - electricity can be pumped in to recharge it, but no fuel.
        _hypx 4y ago
        Fuel cells do not consume fuel. It converts hydrogen and oxygen into water. You can reconvert water back into hydrogen and oxygen. You can conceive of a fully closed-cycle system for this. But it's not worth it, since you are just carrying a big tank of water for no reason. It is a smarter solution that a battery which does carry everything at all times.

I don't think most people truly appreciate how difficult hydrogen is to work with. It is nothing like fossil fuels which can happily sit in a regular tank for extended periods of time and be fine.

theshrike79 4y ago

Way too many people advocating for hydrogen vehicles seriously have an idea in their mind where they just pour hydrogen into a their current vehicle, and it'll still make the comforting brr-brr sounds they're used to. They don't actually want a hydrogen vehicle, they just don't want an EV and use "hydrogen is coming Soon(tm)" as justification for it.

_hypx 4y ago
People have actually looked seriously at what a world of only EVs would look like. It is basically a disaster of unsustainable resource consumption. Hence the need for hydrogen cars. EV believers have their own misperceptions about what is a good idea and what isn't.
- theshrike79 4y ago
  These "People" tend to have an agenda. Like the one report that warned us that the earth didn't have enough lithium to electrify everything. Turns out they calculated that we need, for some reason, enough batteries to store a full month's worth of global electricity production in batteries. No wonder they got the fancy headline :D Battery tech is constantly evolving. There are cobalt-free and lithium-free batteries in the pipeline already. We even have wood-based batteries on experimental stage: https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20221215-the-batteries-made-from-wood https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20221215-the-batteries-ma...
  - _hypx 4y ago
    Should be noted that fuel cells are batteries. We can already eliminate this problem right away. But we must "wait" for future batteries for no reason at all.
    - askvictor 4y ago
      No, fuel cells consume fuel; effectively they are oxidising it in order to make electricity directly. For a hydrogen fuel cell, you still need to add hydrogen when it runs out. Whereas a battery (in the accepted usage of the word) is self-contained - electricity can be pumped in to recharge it, but no fuel.
      - _hypx 4y ago
        Fuel cells do not consume fuel. It converts hydrogen and oxygen into water. You can reconvert water back into hydrogen and oxygen. You can conceive of a fully closed-cycle system for this. But it's not worth it, since you are just carrying a big tank of water for no reason. It is a smarter solution that a battery which does carry everything at all times.