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‘Living in shipping containers’:HMB shooting reveals poor conditions on CA farms

4 points by NoRagrets 4y ago

jelliclesfarm 4y ago
[..]farms in the region with fair working conditions, low pay and substandard housing are systemic throughout the industry. The housing prospects for workers are particularly bad because rents are so high. She said she knew of one group of 16 adults living in a 1,000-square-foot apartment who had to line up every morning to use the bathroom.[..] This BEGS the question.. why is the industry growing low value perishable commodity crops for out of state sales …in a state where housing is chronically challenged even for highly paid workers…in a state with a historically high COLA .. if you can’t run your business without low paid manual labour and that has to resort to obtaining undocumented workers illegally, should that industry even exist. Curious minds want to know. Just like the homeless situation in CA is needed and required to disburse millions of tax dollars to non profits and the care and feeding of their employees…poorly paid migrant labour and unsustainable ag sector is needed to employ all the ancillary industries that rely on California’s produce to keep unemployment down. The value of Ag produce in CA is around 45ish billion. The total amount Ag contributes to GDP is 350+ billion. The industry isn’t Ag. It is the creation of jobs for other industries and job sectors.
- jelliclesfarm 4y ago
  In other words, lowly paid undocumented and migrant farm workers is to Ag jobs sector in California what the mentally ill drug addicted homeless population is to non profits in California. It’s about creation of other jobs to expand tax payer base.
jelliclesfarm 4y ago
this is why farming as it goes on now in California is never sustainable… there isn’t enough margins to pay manual labour a living wage or benefits. This is why we must AUTOMATE and start farming small acreages. A network of automated small acreages that takes care of local food. Whether we need industrial/commercial farms which are essentially open air factories that have horrific working conditions and environmentally debilitating for meager profits is something for CA to decide. Do we really need to ship perishable lettuce that is mostly water across the country or grow almonds to sell all over the world at rock bottom prices which extracts value from unsustainable practices and exploitative labour? There will never be enough margins to pay living wages in CA…That’s not going to work. Automation is the only way. Ag as an industry to ship perishable lettuce and growing almonds in one of the highest COLA states in the country is insanity…that’s like buying retail and selling wholesale
dieselgate 4y ago
Wow I lived in a shipping container for half a year while working on a (mostly) lettuce farm in the north bay area. There was a 5th wheel the permanent field crew lived in (compared to migrant workers who would only show up in the spring/summer months) and also a yurt/dome type thing the farm owner previously lived in that a current-manager now lived in. The container(s) was fine - but not glamorous, they didn't get excessively hot ever. There was also a kitchen, shower (with laundry? don't remember) all in parts of different containers. There are some other places people (field crew) lived (some bus/camper type thing). I honestly couldn't read the whole article because of the paywall but just because it's a container doesn't automatically mean it's "poor conditions" - though of course that can be true. In general agricultural workers face bad working/living conditions but from my specific experience here I cannot say that was the case (farm is relatively small ~35 acres). My only relevant recollection was, after spending a lot of time on public transit (bus/train), living in a container, and spending many of my working hours in a refrigerated trucking unit - my entire world felt 10 feet wide. I look back fondly at that time - the farm management/owners were difficult to deal with though (it's a rough business - not excuses though). Edit: I get the impression working in ag. in the states is a lucrative (and difficult) seasonal job for the migrant workers who choose to take it on. It sort of reminds me of how seasonal workers (from around the world) would head up to Alaska for the commercial fishing/crabbing seasons because it's risky but lucrative.
- jelliclesfarm 4y ago
  Some assumptions: you are American and you were able to quit lettuce farm job and able to look back at those times with fondness. These farm laborers will never post on HN. $9/hour without healthcare or benefits is not ‘lucrative’ unless we are speaking of migrant labour crews who are undocumented. Those who defend the use of undocumented labourers in Ag are simply enabling slave labour. Unless we take a firm stand against undocumented labour, we will never have a true picture of our economy and cost of living the American life. Considering American farms rely on undocumented labour only because it’s cheap and exploitative, we will never find Americans wanting to do these jobs. Automation is the only way out. And realistic output of Ag. [..]“Some of you should see where these folks are living, the conditions they’re in. Living in shipping containers, making $9 an hour,” he said. “No health care, no support services.”[..] [..]“The conditions farmworkers shared with the governor — being paid $9 an hour and living in shipping containers — are simply deplorable,” Villaseñor wrote. “Our country relies on their back-breaking work, yet Congress cannot even provide them the stability of raising their families and working in this country without fear of deportation, which contributes to their vulnerability in the workplace. That is no way to live.”[..]

4 points by NoRagrets 4y ago

[..]farms in the region with fair working conditions, low pay and substandard housing are systemic throughout the industry. The housing prospects for workers are particularly bad because rents are so high. She said she knew of one group of 16 adults living in a 1,000-square-foot apartment who had to line up every morning to use the bathroom.[..] This BEGS the question.. why is the industry growing low value perishable commodity crops for out of state sales …in a state where housing is chronically challenged even for highly paid workers…in a state with a historically high COLA .. if you can’t run your business without low paid manual labour and that has to resort to obtaining undocumented workers illegally, should that industry even exist. Curious minds want to know. Just like the homeless situation in CA is needed and required to disburse millions of tax dollars to non profits and the care and feeding of their employees…poorly paid migrant labour and unsustainable ag sector is needed to employ all the ancillary industries that rely on California’s produce to keep unemployment down. The value of Ag produce in CA is around 45ish billion. The total amount Ag contributes to GDP is 350+ billion. The industry isn’t Ag. It is the creation of jobs for other industries and job sectors.

jelliclesfarm 4y ago
In other words, lowly paid undocumented and migrant farm workers is to Ag jobs sector in California what the mentally ill drug addicted homeless population is to non profits in California. It’s about creation of other jobs to expand tax payer base.

jelliclesfarm 4y ago

this is why farming as it goes on now in California is never sustainable… there isn’t enough margins to pay manual labour a living wage or benefits. This is why we must AUTOMATE and start farming small acreages. A network of automated small acreages that takes care of local food. Whether we need industrial/commercial farms which are essentially open air factories that have horrific working conditions and environmentally debilitating for meager profits is something for CA to decide. Do we really need to ship perishable lettuce that is mostly water across the country or grow almonds to sell all over the world at rock bottom prices which extracts value from unsustainable practices and exploitative labour? There will never be enough margins to pay living wages in CA…That’s not going to work. Automation is the only way. Ag as an industry to ship perishable lettuce and growing almonds in one of the highest COLA states in the country is insanity…that’s like buying retail and selling wholesale

dieselgate 4y ago

Wow I lived in a shipping container for half a year while working on a (mostly) lettuce farm in the north bay area. There was a 5th wheel the permanent field crew lived in (compared to migrant workers who would only show up in the spring/summer months) and also a yurt/dome type thing the farm owner previously lived in that a current-manager now lived in. The container(s) was fine - but not glamorous, they didn't get excessively hot ever. There was also a kitchen, shower (with laundry? don't remember) all in parts of different containers. There are some other places people (field crew) lived (some bus/camper type thing). I honestly couldn't read the whole article because of the paywall but just because it's a container doesn't automatically mean it's "poor conditions" - though of course that can be true. In general agricultural workers face bad working/living conditions but from my specific experience here I cannot say that was the case (farm is relatively small ~35 acres). My only relevant recollection was, after spending a lot of time on public transit (bus/train), living in a container, and spending many of my working hours in a refrigerated trucking unit - my entire world felt 10 feet wide. I look back fondly at that time - the farm management/owners were difficult to deal with though (it's a rough business - not excuses though). Edit: I get the impression working in ag. in the states is a lucrative (and difficult) seasonal job for the migrant workers who choose to take it on. It sort of reminds me of how seasonal workers (from around the world) would head up to Alaska for the commercial fishing/crabbing seasons because it's risky but lucrative.

jelliclesfarm 4y ago
Some assumptions: you are American and you were able to quit lettuce farm job and able to look back at those times with fondness. These farm laborers will never post on HN. $9/hour without healthcare or benefits is not ‘lucrative’ unless we are speaking of migrant labour crews who are undocumented. Those who defend the use of undocumented labourers in Ag are simply enabling slave labour. Unless we take a firm stand against undocumented labour, we will never have a true picture of our economy and cost of living the American life. Considering American farms rely on undocumented labour only because it’s cheap and exploitative, we will never find Americans wanting to do these jobs. Automation is the only way out. And realistic output of Ag. [..]“Some of you should see where these folks are living, the conditions they’re in. Living in shipping containers, making $9 an hour,” he said. “No health care, no support services.”[..] [..]“The conditions farmworkers shared with the governor — being paid $9 an hour and living in shipping containers — are simply deplorable,” Villaseñor wrote. “Our country relies on their back-breaking work, yet Congress cannot even provide them the stability of raising their families and working in this country without fear of deportation, which contributes to their vulnerability in the workplace. That is no way to live.”[..]