4 ms·

Well, the minimum wage is lower now than it was in 1950, but the cost of a one bedroom apartment is several times higher. And so this is what you get. The bu

Well, the minimum wage is lower now than it was in 1950, but the cost of a one bedroom apartment is several times higher. And so this is what you get. The business gets labor for almost free and the customers who are willing to tip support the powerless worker, who probably has tens of thousands of dollars of college debt. And most of that tip money goes directly to the landlord. Meanwhile, the cost of education and health care continues to skyrocket. Makes you wonder whether unregulated capitalism is as amazing a system as it's made out to be. It's amazing for those at the top, I suppose. Anyways, don't take it out on the worker. This country is a hellscape for most young people right now.

vlod 4y ago
> who probably has tens of thousands of dollars of college debt. > Makes you wonder whether unregulated capitalism is as amazing a system as it's made out to be. Huh? You're saying one can only get a minimum paid job with a college degree (plus lots of debt). Isn't that saying that the selection of the degree wasn't the wisest choice? i.e. ROI Not sure I would put the blame solely only on the capitalist system for that.
- fallingfrog 4y ago
  Now I’m trying very hard not to start a flame war- but please, at least make an argument that isn’t just a straw man. I said that many people working minimum or low wages have college debts; I did not say that “one can only get a minimum wage job with a college degree.” All beetles are insects but not all insects are beetles, you understand this right? I can’t imagine a more fatuous thing to say. Disgusting.
  - vlod 4y ago
    >I said that many people working minimum or low wages have college debts; I did not say that “one can only get a minimum wage job with a college degree.” I was trying to be subtle and I thought it was obvious. It's (mostly) down to accountability and the choices that people make. If you go into debt and choose to study "Stem/Law/Finance", you mostly won't be working in a minimal paying job. If you go into debt and choose to study (I don't know) "French Art Literature", you might have problems getting by. Is this 100% guarantee? Of course not, having Finance from Wharton and choosing to live in farmland state won't do you that much good. If you have a law degree from Harvard and choose to look after an ageing parent in SmallTown, US, you'll most likely have a hard time. Sometimes bad things happen to people. However I don't believe the majority of graduates are in that position. I suspect they made bad decisions in choosing their major, maybe they partied too much and didn't get the grade they wanted. Of course, you might have to move to a major city. If you don't that's a choice. I don't understand why there is an expectation that if you spent a great deal of money to go to college and then don't have a valuable skill that you can sell to society, that everyone should give you a break.
- lockhouse 4y ago
  You mean my women’s studies degree with a minor in philosophy that cost the same as a STEM degree from a private college was a bad investment?
  - fallingfrog 4y ago
    Responding to valid criticism with contempt is the mark of someone who knows they are wrong, but can’t admit it to themselves
lockhouse 4y ago
Playing Devil’s Advocate here, but minimum wage earners are being subsidized by local, state, and federal governments. They usually don’t have to pay full price for groceries, rent, healthcare, or education. The bottom of the middle class are the ones suffering the most right now as they make just enough to not qualify for these subsidies, but not enough to comfortably absorb recent increases to their cost of living.
- fallingfrog 4y ago
  This is partly true, but I think that it’s hard to know who has it worse without looking at the lived experiences of people from both groups. I suspect you’re basing your ideas about the welfare state off how things were 30 years ago. Benefits have been cut everywhere.

vlod 4y ago

> who probably has tens of thousands of dollars of college debt. > Makes you wonder whether unregulated capitalism is as amazing a system as it's made out to be. Huh? You're saying one can only get a minimum paid job with a college degree (plus lots of debt). Isn't that saying that the selection of the degree wasn't the wisest choice? i.e. ROI Not sure I would put the blame solely only on the capitalist system for that.

fallingfrog 4y ago
Now I’m trying very hard not to start a flame war- but please, at least make an argument that isn’t just a straw man. I said that many people working minimum or low wages have college debts; I did not say that “one can only get a minimum wage job with a college degree.” All beetles are insects but not all insects are beetles, you understand this right? I can’t imagine a more fatuous thing to say. Disgusting.
- vlod 4y ago
  >I said that many people working minimum or low wages have college debts; I did not say that “one can only get a minimum wage job with a college degree.” I was trying to be subtle and I thought it was obvious. It's (mostly) down to accountability and the choices that people make. If you go into debt and choose to study "Stem/Law/Finance", you mostly won't be working in a minimal paying job. If you go into debt and choose to study (I don't know) "French Art Literature", you might have problems getting by. Is this 100% guarantee? Of course not, having Finance from Wharton and choosing to live in farmland state won't do you that much good. If you have a law degree from Harvard and choose to look after an ageing parent in SmallTown, US, you'll most likely have a hard time. Sometimes bad things happen to people. However I don't believe the majority of graduates are in that position. I suspect they made bad decisions in choosing their major, maybe they partied too much and didn't get the grade they wanted. Of course, you might have to move to a major city. If you don't that's a choice. I don't understand why there is an expectation that if you spent a great deal of money to go to college and then don't have a valuable skill that you can sell to society, that everyone should give you a break.
lockhouse 4y ago
You mean my women’s studies degree with a minor in philosophy that cost the same as a STEM degree from a private college was a bad investment?
- fallingfrog 4y ago
  Responding to valid criticism with contempt is the mark of someone who knows they are wrong, but can’t admit it to themselves

lockhouse 4y ago

Playing Devil’s Advocate here, but minimum wage earners are being subsidized by local, state, and federal governments. They usually don’t have to pay full price for groceries, rent, healthcare, or education. The bottom of the middle class are the ones suffering the most right now as they make just enough to not qualify for these subsidies, but not enough to comfortably absorb recent increases to their cost of living.

fallingfrog 4y ago
This is partly true, but I think that it’s hard to know who has it worse without looking at the lived experiences of people from both groups. I suspect you’re basing your ideas about the welfare state off how things were 30 years ago. Benefits have been cut everywhere.