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I don’t mind feeding FlightAware and Flightradar24 - they’re for-profit companies, and are clear about the terms of exchange something of (dubious) value for th

I don’t mind feeding FlightAware and Flightradar24 - they’re for-profit companies, and are clear about the terms of exchange something of (dubious) value for the data they receive. This feels a lot more skeezy. Oh well, fool me once, and all that. I do look forward to shutting down my feed once I’m back in front of a computer. Something something, why we can’t have nice things.

james_pm 4y ago
Same. I get value back from FR24 in the form of a Business subscription which gives me a TON of data and access I wouldn't be able to afford. I fed ADS-B Exchange for nothing because it seemed like a nice thing to do to benefit the wider tracking community. To have the founder cash out and sell OUR data without even talking to the community first? That really rubbed me the wrong way. I stopped feeding about an hour ago.
- Havoc 4y ago
  Also doing same re FR24 and biz sub. Curious what data you use from it though? I haven't had much use for it frankly
  - james_pm 4y ago
    I'm interested in a lot of different forms of transportation as a hobby. Photography, tracking, etc. Being able to see the flight history of a specific airframe is interesting to me or going back and looking at past flights. Fleets is another feature I use. For example, I've been interested in trying to get photos of the new E915-E2 jets that Porter Airlines is adding so I've created a "fleet" and can easily track the whereabouts in the hopes of being able to catch one in flight to photograph.
    - Havoc 4y ago
      Got it. Thanks
metadaemon 4y ago
These were already very skeezy guys if you interacted with them on Discord.
- nocoiner 4y ago
  I think I’m on their server, but I don’t think I ever really interacted with them. In retrospect, I suppose I should have and gotten a better sense of their character (which is why I’m being a bit more careful in evaluating whether I start feeding anyone new). Too bad that every TOS out there basically boils down to “we own your data to the maximum extent that doesn’t create any liability for us (but if it does, you’ll indemnify us) and we can change these terms at any time.” Makes it hard to do a proper assessment of what exactly you’re stepping into.
  - metadaemon 4y ago
    In my experience they were weirdly hostile about a question about supporting live WebSocket feeds of incoming data. SoylentADSB had developed one of those trivial chat applications you do when learning about WebSockets and flamed me for even asking. When I questioned him about it he got very defensive and started resorting to personal attacks. By the end the the discussion he had deleted all of the pertaining chat messages from Discord, which I found childish. If you read past logs of his conversations, he's notorious for acting like that with people asking legitimate questions. In my opinion, that's the exact opposite type of person that you want running this sort of thing that is essentially propped up by the community. It's a skeevy model today because they actually profit off of what the community provides. Ideally, this would all be open sourced and run by some governance board just like any successful open sourced venture.
zymhan 4y ago
FlightAware was less skeezy before they were bought by L3 Harris. I'm not in this hobby to help out defense contractors. ADSBx are still far worse, since they built the site as an "open community".
- devstar 4y ago
  Your remark about FlightAware being owned by L3 Harris piqued my interest since I was not aware of this. I took a look at their About section and it seems they are actually owned by Collins Aerospace a subsidiary of Raytheon. Does not change your point but just a small correction and I also learned something new.
  - zymhan 4y ago
    Aha, thanks for the correction
- Cesartheiceman 4y ago
  I prefer RadarBox. They are an independent company. And we have a community of feeders on WhatsApps and Telegram.

james_pm 4y ago

Same. I get value back from FR24 in the form of a Business subscription which gives me a TON of data and access I wouldn't be able to afford. I fed ADS-B Exchange for nothing because it seemed like a nice thing to do to benefit the wider tracking community. To have the founder cash out and sell OUR data without even talking to the community first? That really rubbed me the wrong way. I stopped feeding about an hour ago.

Havoc 4y ago
Also doing same re FR24 and biz sub. Curious what data you use from it though? I haven't had much use for it frankly
- james_pm 4y ago
  I'm interested in a lot of different forms of transportation as a hobby. Photography, tracking, etc. Being able to see the flight history of a specific airframe is interesting to me or going back and looking at past flights. Fleets is another feature I use. For example, I've been interested in trying to get photos of the new E915-E2 jets that Porter Airlines is adding so I've created a "fleet" and can easily track the whereabouts in the hopes of being able to catch one in flight to photograph.
  - Havoc 4y ago
    Got it. Thanks

metadaemon 4y ago

These were already very skeezy guys if you interacted with them on Discord.

nocoiner 4y ago
I think I’m on their server, but I don’t think I ever really interacted with them. In retrospect, I suppose I should have and gotten a better sense of their character (which is why I’m being a bit more careful in evaluating whether I start feeding anyone new). Too bad that every TOS out there basically boils down to “we own your data to the maximum extent that doesn’t create any liability for us (but if it does, you’ll indemnify us) and we can change these terms at any time.” Makes it hard to do a proper assessment of what exactly you’re stepping into.
- metadaemon 4y ago
  In my experience they were weirdly hostile about a question about supporting live WebSocket feeds of incoming data. SoylentADSB had developed one of those trivial chat applications you do when learning about WebSockets and flamed me for even asking. When I questioned him about it he got very defensive and started resorting to personal attacks. By the end the the discussion he had deleted all of the pertaining chat messages from Discord, which I found childish. If you read past logs of his conversations, he's notorious for acting like that with people asking legitimate questions. In my opinion, that's the exact opposite type of person that you want running this sort of thing that is essentially propped up by the community. It's a skeevy model today because they actually profit off of what the community provides. Ideally, this would all be open sourced and run by some governance board just like any successful open sourced venture.

zymhan 4y ago

FlightAware was less skeezy before they were bought by L3 Harris. I'm not in this hobby to help out defense contractors. ADSBx are still far worse, since they built the site as an "open community".

devstar 4y ago
Your remark about FlightAware being owned by L3 Harris piqued my interest since I was not aware of this. I took a look at their About section and it seems they are actually owned by Collins Aerospace a subsidiary of Raytheon. Does not change your point but just a small correction and I also learned something new.
- zymhan 4y ago
  Aha, thanks for the correction
Cesartheiceman 4y ago
I prefer RadarBox. They are an independent company. And we have a community of feeders on WhatsApps and Telegram.